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Bigotry In Religious Organisations

Willows
Posts: 11,592
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12/2/2018 12:33:39 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
I was talking with a Baptist recently and explained to him that his Church has a policy of shunning gays.

His reply was that just because the Church has a certain rule or dictum, It doesn't mean that he necessarily goes along with it.

Has he deceptively avoided the issue by talking generically and in any case, If one belongs to a particular group, Is it not fair to be associated or branded with all its ordinances?
Willows
Posts: 11,592
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12/2/2018 5:03:34 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Leaning wrote:
Sounds a bit like caricaturization.

Put it this way. . . . .

You met someone who belongs to the KKK who tells you that he doesn't agree with the vilification of blacks.
Would you believe him?

Similarly, You meet someone who belongs to a church who tells you that he doesn't agree with the vilification of homosexuals.
Would you believe him?

To believe what the person says in each case, You must have come down in the last shower.

I accept that one does not have to agree with everything about their chosen group but in each of these cases we are talking about serious, Fundamental principals and anyone who says he doesn't go along with those particular principals is lying. . . . . Otherwise he would not be a member.

It's like the old adage used by bigots. . . . . . "I'm not racist, BUT. . . . . . I'm not homophobic, BUT. . . . . . . . "I'm not sexist, BUT. . . . . . "


Whenever I hear that sort of talk I usually roll my eyeballs upward and cut in with, "BUT, You are. "

Great conversation stopper, Don't you think?
Leaning
Posts: 2,555
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12/2/2018 5:07:13 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
I am not deeply familiar with the KKK values, Though I'm going to assume first and foremost they are about discriminating against blacks. I do not think the church is first and foremost about discriminating against homosexuals.

If the KKK guy said he was against the wearing of silly robes I could believe him easier than I could believe him against the discrimination against blacks.

I think you made a good point there, And it took me a moment to think of a decent response. Though I might be sidestepping a bit.
Willows
Posts: 11,592
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12/2/2018 5:18:34 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Leaning wrote:
I am not deeply familiar with the KKK values, Though I'm going to assume first and foremost they are about discriminating against blacks. I do not think the church is first and foremost about discriminating against homosexuals.

Churches may try to mitigate by stating that vilification is not the first thing on each Sunday agenda, In fact, From experience, They don't bring the subject up much.

The fact is though that society views such practice as fundamentally important which is why it has enacted laws which churches are now defying.
Leaning
Posts: 2,555
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12/2/2018 5:22:45 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Hmm, You would have to give an example. I have mixed and not fully thought out opinions on what people should and should not be allowed to do. At a knee jerk thought, It seems fine to me for a cake shop to refuse to make a gay cake. It is fine also for people to picket and refuse to give that cake shop any business since they do that. I would not agree with government shutting down that shop however.
Willows
Posts: 11,592
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12/2/2018 6:49:02 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Leaning wrote:
Hmm, You would have to give an example. I have mixed and not fully thought out opinions on what people should and should not be allowed to do. At a knee jerk thought, It seems fine to me for a cake shop to refuse to make a gay cake. It is fine also for people to picket and refuse to give that cake shop any business since they do that. I would not agree with government shutting down that shop however.

I think you will find that (in the eyes of the law) it is not ok for the cake shop to refuse to bake a gay cake.
The case in the US is still ongoing and the ruling by the court in favor of the cake shop was only that the demonstrators acted unlawfully in being over-forceful. . . It had nothing to do with the anti-discrimination laws.

As it stands, It is illegal for a business to refuse its service purely on the grounds of racial or sexual discrimination.
Willows
Posts: 11,592
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12/2/2018 10:14:23 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Leaning wrote:
You are correct. And I am unsure if I agree with that law.

I know what you mean.
I mean, Think of a cake baker. . . A gay couple come into the shop.
He would be very concerned that they would be breathing HIV virus and probably left the germs on the doorknob.
And, He would be worried about his standing in the community if people outside saw the gay couple going out with a cake. . . . . "Gee, Do they think I'm gay or a gay sympathizer and, Cripes, They might burn my shop down and lynch me".

And, He would be a homophobe.
Willows
Posts: 11,592
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12/2/2018 10:46:17 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Leaning wrote:
Nah, He just wouldn't want to do something against his values.

. . . . His "values" of being a homophobe, That is.

What makes a distasteful belief, Driven by ignorance and arrogance even more distasteful is the insistence of the beholder that he does not harbor such views.

"Derrrrr, Like errr, I'm not a homophobe but I have values you know and I think %$#@*** sticking it in @#$! *&^% poofter ****#$@*& fudge shoving *%$#*##. . . . . . Etc. Etc. "

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