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Does the bible make sense?

Harikrish
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3/16/2017 9:02:49 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
After creating Adam and Eve. God tells them they can eat from any tree in the garden except one.

Genesis 2:17 but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat from it you will certainly die."

What happens when they disobey God and eat the forbidden fruit?

Genesis 3:22 And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life firever.

They become like him and now he does not want them to live forever.

So what does God do? He punishes Adam and Eve for disobeying him.


Genesis 3: 14 So the Lord God said to the serpent, "Because you have done this, "Cursed are you above all livestock and all wild animals. You will crawl on your belly and you will eat dust all the days of your life.
15 And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring[a] and hers; he will crush[b] your head, and you will strike his heel."
16 To the woman he said, "I will make your pains in childbearing very severe; with painful labor you will give birth to children. Your desire will be for your husband, and he will rule over you."
17 To Adam he said, "Because you listened to your wife and ate fruit from the tree about which I commanded you, "You must not eat from it," "Cursed is the ground because of you; through painful toil you will eat food from it all the days of your life.
18 It will produce thorns and thistles for you, and you will eat the plants of the field.
19 By the sweat of your brow you will eat your foo until you return to the ground, since from it you were taken for dust you are and to dust you will return."

The rest of the bible is about God sending prophets to teach the people what is good and evil and laws they should obey. Why?

Odd that God is asking them to learn the difference between good and evil when he punished Adam and Eve for eating the forbidden fruit because they were desirous of gaining wisdom of good and evil. God was against them learning then in the Garden. Now he sends prophets to teach them and wonders why they are reluctant to learn forgetting he punished them when they wanted to learn.

Genesis 3:6 When the woman saw that the fruit of the tree was good for food and pleasing to the eye, and also desirable for gaining wisdom, she took some and ate it. She also gave some to her husband, who was with her, and he ate it.

Because Adam and Eve gained the knowledge and became like Him, God did not want them to also live forever. So he banished them from the garden and had angels guard the tree of life.

So why did he send his only begotten son Jesus?


John 3:16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

But it was God who took away the tree of life so they would not live forever. Now he is offering Jesus to restore what he took away from them Ie the tree of life.

God suffers from circular reasoning/logic. The bible only makes sense if you suffer from the same condition.
Circular reasoning (Latin: circulus in probando, "circle in proving"; also known as circular logic) is a logical fallacy in which the reasoner begins with what they are trying to end with. The components of a circular argument are often logically valid because if the premises are true, the conclusion must be true.

In short, God is trying to restore his creation back to Paradise which he took away from Adam and Eve for disobeying him by desiring what he wanted them to learn anyways.
12_13
Posts: 2,575
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3/16/2017 9:58:59 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/16/2017 9:02:49 PM, Harikrish wrote:
So what does God do? He punishes Adam and Eve for disobeying him.

Actually, He just does what He promised. And if people then got the knowledge about evil, as they wanted, how could that be seen as punishment. They should be thankful, when they got just what they asked.

The rest of the bible is about God sending prophets to teach the people what is good and evil and laws they should obey. Why?

Because people don"t seem to understand it on their own.

Odd that God is asking them to learn the difference between good and evil when he punished Adam and Eve for eating the forbidden fruit because they were desirous of gaining wisdom of good and evil. God was against them learning then in the Garden.

The garden didn"t have evil, so it was not possible to learn evil as people wanted in the Garden, that is why they had to be expelled to this death to learn what evil truly means.

And it is important to notice, it was not possible to know evil in the Garden the way people wanted to know. But there was possibility to ask everything directly from God the Father, like children, but people wanted to become like God, so it was not only about knowledge, it was about vanity or something like that.

Because Adam and Eve gained the knowledge and became like Him, God did not want them to also live forever. So he banished them from the garden and had angels guard the tree of life.

No, the reason was that that way we had the opportunity to know evil as people wanted to know it.

But it was God who took away the tree of life so they would not live forever. Now he is offering Jesus to restore what he took away from them Ie the tree of life.

The offer is only for righteous, for people that get right understanding and so are suitable to eternal life. Unrighteous are not for the eternal life. Jesus came to show way to become righteous.
Face-of-the-deep
Posts: 80
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3/17/2017 5:13:15 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/16/2017 9:02:49 PM, Harikrish wrote:
After creating Adam and Eve. God tells them they can eat from any tree in the garden except one.

Genesis 2:17 but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat from it you will certainly die."

What happens when they disobey God and eat the forbidden fruit?

Genesis 3:22 And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life firever.

Genesis 3:22 Then the Lord God said, "Behold, the man has become like one of Us, knowing good and evil; and now, lest he stretch out his hand, and take also from the tree of life, and eat, and live forever"--(This, in my view, is the key to the Adam and Eve story that they failed to eat from the tree of life and were expelled from the knowledge of eternal life.) The key word, people miss is (lest) which means (unless).
It took me about 15 times through this story before I figured it out.
I started realizing that the Bible is a spiritual book. (Unseen but by spiritual). Thinking in the physical world doesn't fit, think only in the spirit.
What do children of God, grow up to be like? If you don't have tears of overflowing joy yet, then you haven't figured it out. Maybe, until now.

They become like him and now he does not want them to live forever.

So what does God do? He punishes Adam and Eve for disobeying him.


Genesis 3: 14 So the Lord God said to the serpent, "Because you have done this, "Cursed are you above all livestock and all wild animals. You will crawl on your belly and you will eat dust all the days of your life.
15 And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring[a] and hers; he will crush[b] your head, and you will strike his heel."
16 To the woman he said, "I will make your pains in childbearing very severe; with painful labor you will give birth to children. Your desire will be for your husband, and he will rule over you."
17 To Adam he said, "Because you listened to your wife and ate fruit from the tree about which I commanded you, "You must not eat from it," "Cursed is the ground because of you; through painful toil you will eat food from it all the days of your life.
18 It will produce thorns and thistles for you, and you will eat the plants of the field.
19 By the sweat of your brow you will eat your foo until you return to the ground, since from it you were taken for dust you are and to dust you will return."

The rest of the bible is about God sending prophets to teach the people what is good and evil and laws they should obey. Why?

Odd that God is asking them to learn the difference between good and evil when he punished Adam and Eve for eating the forbidden fruit because they were desirous of gaining wisdom of good and evil. God was against them learning then in the Garden. Now he sends prophets to teach them and wonders why they are reluctant to learn forgetting he punished them when they wanted to learn.

Genesis 3:6 When the woman saw that the fruit of the tree was good for food and pleasing to the eye, and also desirable for gaining wisdom, she took some and ate it. She also gave some to her husband, who was with her, and he ate it.

Because Adam and Eve gained the knowledge and became like Him, God did not want them to also live forever. So he banished them from the garden and had angels guard the tree of life.

So why did he send his only begotten son Jesus?


John 3:16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

But it was God who took away the tree of life so they would not live forever. Now he is offering Jesus to restore what he took away from them Ie the tree of life.

God suffers from circular reasoning/logic. The bible only makes sense if you suffer from the same condition.
Circular reasoning (Latin: circulus in probando, "circle in proving"; also known as circular logic) is a logical fallacy in which the reasoner begins with what they are trying to end with. The components of a circular argument are often logically valid because if the premises are true, the conclusion must be true.

In short, God is trying to restore his creation back to Paradise which he took away from Adam and Eve for disobeying him by desiring what he wanted them to learn anyways.
tarantula
Posts: 1,604
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3/17/2017 11:25:07 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
Much of the Bible, like the creation story, is just not credible, and nor is there any verifiable evidence to support it.
Looncall
Posts: 707
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3/17/2017 11:44:15 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/17/2017 11:25:07 AM, tarantula wrote:
Much of the Bible, like the creation story, is just not credible, and nor is there any verifiable evidence to support it.

I agree, but I think you still give it too much credit. It is clearly just a collection of folk tales and religious, tribal and political propaganda. Had it not been used by priests for their own benefit, it would have been forgotten long ago.
The metaphysicist has no laboratory.
Harikrish
Posts: 39,173
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3/17/2017 4:58:34 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/16/2017 9:58:59 PM, 12_13 wrote:
At 3/16/2017 9:02:49 PM, Harikrish wrote:
So what does God do? He punishes Adam and Eve for disobeying him.

Actually, He just does what He promised. And if people then got the knowledge about evil, as they wanted, how could that be seen as punishment. They should be thankful, when they got just what they asked.

So you agree God punished Adam and Eve even though he declared by eating the fruit of knowledge they had become like Him knowing good and evil.

Genesis 3:22 And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and live forever.

God was upset humans now had the knowledge of good and evil that he intended only trees to have.

The rest of the bible is about God sending prophets to teach the people what is good and evil and laws they should obey. Why?

Because people don"t seem to understand it on their own.

They understand good and evil very well. The first thing they discovered God was ogling at their naked bodies and covered up. They knew the knowledge of good and evil only came from a tree. They rejected anyone who claimed to possess the knowledge of good and evil including the prophets and Jesus because God told Adam and Eve He put that knowledge only in a tree.

Odd that God is asking them to learn the difference between good and evil when he punished Adam and Eve for eating the forbidden fruit because they were desirous of gaining wisdom of good and evil. God was against them learning then in the Garden.

The garden didn"t have evil, so it was not possible to learn evil as people wanted in the Garden, that is why they had to be expelled to this death to learn what evil truly means.

Evil was already there in heaven before creation. That is where Satan learned of it. The battle of angels began in heaven. It was Satan aka talking serpent that talked Adam and Eve into eating the fruit.

And it is important to notice, it was not possible to know evil in the Garden the way people wanted to know. But there was possibility to ask everything directly from God the Father, like children, but people wanted to become like God, so it was not only about knowledge, it was about vanity or something like that.

We cannot help it, we are all gods.we were created in his image, in the image of a God.

John 10:34 Jesus answered them, "Is it not written in your Law, 'I have said you are "gods"'?

Genesis 1:27 So God created mankind in his own image, in the image of God he created them; male and female he created them.

Because Adam and Eve gained the knowledge and became like Him, God did not want them to also live forever. So he banished them from the garden and had angels guard the tree of life.

No, the reason was that that way we had the opportunity to know evil as people wanted to know it.

The only evil we learnt was what God put in the tree of knowledge of good and evil. We had no other source for that knowledge.

But it was God who took away the tree of life so they would not live forever. Now he is offering Jesus to restore what he took away from them Ie the tree of life.

The offer is only for righteous, for people that get right understanding and so are suitable to eternal life. Unrighteous are not for the eternal life. Jesus came to show way to become righteous.

But Jesus did not show the path to the tree of life. He pointed instead to his body. But his body is no longer here. And one has to eat his flesh and drink his blood to have eternal life because he was offering his real flesh and real blood. But he cannot do that anymore as a dead Jewish rabbi that was nailed to a wooden cross 2000 years ago.

John 6: 54 Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day. 55 For my flesh is real food and my blood is real drink.
Harikrish
Posts: 39,173
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3/17/2017 5:18:32 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/17/2017 5:13:15 AM, Face-of-the-deep wrote:
At 3/16/2017 9:02:49 PM, Harikrish wrote:
After creating Adam and Eve. God tells them they can eat from any tree in the garden except one.

Genesis 2:17 but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat from it you will certainly die."

What happens when they disobey God and eat the forbidden fruit?

Genesis 3:22 And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life firever.

Genesis 3:22 Then the Lord God said, "Behold, the man has become like one of Us, knowing good and evil; and now, lest he stretch out his hand, and take also from the tree of life, and eat, and live forever"--(This, in my view, is the key to the Adam and Eve story that they failed to eat from the tree of life and were expelled from the knowledge of eternal life.) The key word, people miss is (lest) which means (unless).
It took me about 15 times through this story before I figured it out.

Even after 15 attempts your senility still got the better of you.

Genesis 3:22 says They become like him and now he does not want them to live forever. God is afraid Adam will stretch out his hand next , and take also from the tree of life, and eat, and live forever. The tree of life gave immortality to anyone who ate its fruit. Just like the tree of knowledge gave knowledge to anyone who ate its fruit.

So God fearing they will also eat of the tree of life and live forever drove them out of the garden and put angels to guard the tree.

Genesis 3:24 After he drove the man out, he placed on the east side of the Garden of Eden cherubim and a flaming sword flashing back and forth to guard the way to the tree of life.

I started realizing that the Bible is a spiritual book. (Unseen but by spiritual). Thinking in the physical world doesn't fit, think only in the spirit.
You can take bible courses and earn a degree. There is nothing spiritual about a book written by many human authors

What do children of God, grow up to be like? If you don't have tears of overflowing joy yet, then you haven't figured it out. Maybe, until now.

It didn't go too well for Jesus and his disciples they were all killed, or for the early Christians during the Roman period, or during the inquisition or today with pedophillia rampant among priests

They become like him and now he does not want them to live forever.

So what does God do? He punishes Adam and Eve for disobeying him.


Genesis 3: 14 So the Lord God said to the serpent, "Because you have done this, "Cursed are you above all livestock and all wild animals. You will crawl on your belly and you will eat dust all the days of your life.
15 And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring[a] and hers; he will crush[b] your head, and you will strike his heel."
16 To the woman he said, "I will make your pains in childbearing very severe; with painful labor you will give birth to children. Your desire will be for your husband, and he will rule over you."
17 To Adam he said, "Because you listened to your wife and ate fruit from the tree about which I commanded you, "You must not eat from it," "Cursed is the ground because of you; through painful toil you will eat food from it all the days of your life.
18 It will produce thorns and thistles for you, and you will eat the plants of the field.
19 By the sweat of your brow you will eat your foo until you return to the ground, since from it you were taken for dust you are and to dust you will return."

The rest of the bible is about God sending prophets to teach the people what is good and evil and laws they should obey. Why?

Odd that God is asking them to learn the difference between good and evil when he punished Adam and Eve for eating the forbidden fruit because they were desirous of gaining wisdom of good and evil. God was against them learning then in the Garden. Now he sends prophets to teach them and wonders why they are reluctant to learn forgetting he punished them when they wanted to learn.

Genesis 3:6 When the woman saw that the fruit of the tree was good for food and pleasing to the eye, and also desirable for gaining wisdom, she took some and ate it. She also gave some to her husband, who was with her, and he ate it.

Because Adam and Eve gained the knowledge and became like Him, God did not want them to also live forever. So he banished them from the garden and had angels guard the tree of life.

So why did he send his only begotten son Jesus?


John 3:16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

But it was God who took away the tree of life so they would not live forever. Now he is offering Jesus to restore what he took away from them Ie the tree of life.

God suffers from circular reasoning/logic. The bible only makes sense if you suffer from the same condition.
Circular reasoning (Latin: circulus in probando, "circle in proving"; also known as circular logic) is a logical fallacy in which the reasoner begins with what they are trying to end with. The components of a circular argument are often logically valid because if the premises are true, the conclusion must be true.

In short, God is trying to restore his creation back to Paradise which he took away from Adam and Eve for disobeying him by desiring what he wanted them to learn anyways.
12_13
Posts: 2,575
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3/17/2017 6:53:36 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/17/2017 4:58:34 PM, Harikrish wrote:
So you agree God punished Adam and Eve even though he declared by eating the fruit of knowledge they had become like Him knowing good and evil.

Letting people have what they wanted is not in my opinion a punishment.

God was upset humans now had the knowledge of good and evil that he intended only trees to have.

I prefer what the Bible tells rather than your version of it. :)

They understand good and evil very well.

Sorry, I don"t see any good reason to believe that.

Evil was already there in heaven before creation. That is where Satan learned of it. The battle of angels began in heaven. It was Satan aka talking serpent that talked Adam and Eve into eating the fruit.

There is nothing evil in heaven. When Satan rejected God, he was cast out of heaven.

We cannot help it, we are all gods.we were created in his image, in the image of a God.

John 10:34 Jesus answered them, "Is it not written in your Law, 'I have said you are "gods"'?

But don"t you think image is less than the object of an image? Or would you pay same price for a picture of a car as for actual car? And John 10:34 is not saying that all people are gods, it is referring to scripture in the OT that speaks of gods.

God presides in the great assembly. He judges among the gods.
Psalms 82:1

And the point is, some high person were called gods in the Bible.

The only evil we learnt was what God put in the tree of knowledge of good and evil. We had no other source for that knowledge.

Evil is actually same as rejecting God, or living without God. People could have asked that same directly from God, but now, they wanted to become gods that is why I think they chose the harder path.

But Jesus did not show the path to the tree of life. He pointed instead to his body. But his body is no longer here. And one has to eat his flesh and drink his blood to have eternal life because he was offering his real flesh and real blood. But he cannot do that anymore as a dead Jewish rabbi that was nailed to a wooden cross 2000 years ago.

John 6: 54 Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day. 55 For my flesh is real food and my blood is real drink.

But I think you understand wrongly what his flesh means, because John 6 continues with this:

It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh is useless. The words that I have spoken to you are spirit and are life.
John 6:63

And nobody actually ate the physical flesh of Jesus, which I think blatantly proves it was not about the physical body of Jesus.
Ludofl3x
Posts: 2,283
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3/17/2017 6:56:57 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
If he didn't want people to eat from that tree, why did he put it in the garden in the first place? I meanhe had choice to create the garden, right? Total control, etc.? My wife and I don't want our kids drinking soda. Know what we do? the answer isn't put a six pack of coke in the fridge and tell the kids "Don't drink this!" We don't buy soda. It's very simple. And I don't have to cast my kids out of our house forever!
Harikrish
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3/17/2017 10:36:40 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/17/2017 6:53:36 PM, 12_13 wrote:
At 3/17/2017 4:58:34 PM, Harikrish wrote:
So you agree God punished Adam and Eve even though he declared by eating the fruit of knowledge they had become like Him knowing good and evil.

Letting people have what they wanted is not in my opinion a punishment.

You missed my post #8 which includes verses where God's punishes Adam, Eve and the Serpent.

So what does God do? He punishes Adam and Eve for disobeying him.

Genesis 3: 14 So the Lord God said to the serpent, "Because you have done this, "Cursed are you above all livestock and all wild animals. You will crawl on your belly and you will eat dust all the days of your life.
15 And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring[a] and hers; he will crush[b] your head, and you will strike his heel."
16 To the woman he said, "I will make your pains in childbearing very severe; with painful labor you will give birth to children. Your desire will be for your husband, and he will rule over you."
17 To Adam he said, "Because you listened to your wife and ate fruit from the tree about which I commanded you, "You must not eat from it," "Cursed is the ground because of you; through painful toil you will eat food from it all the days of your life.
18 It will produce thorns and thistles for you, and you will eat the plants of the field.
19 By the sweat of your brow you will eat your foo until you return to the ground, since from it you were taken for dust you are and to dust you will return."

God was upset humans now had the knowledge of good and evil that he intended only trees to have.

I prefer what the Bible tells rather than your version of it. :)

I am quoting what the bible tells us. God was upset, he punished Adam, Eve and the Serpent and he put Angels to protect the tree of life.

Genesis 3:22 And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and live forever.

Genesis 3: 14 So the Lord God said to the serpent, "Because you have done this, "Cursed are you above all livestock and all wild animals. You will crawl on your belly and you will eat dust all the days of your life.
15 And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring[a] and hers; he will crush[b] your head, and you will strike his heel."
16 To the woman he said, "I will make your pains in childbearing very severe; with painful labor you will give birth to children. Your desire will be for your husband, and he will rule over you."
17 To Adam he said, "Because you listened to your wife and ate fruit from the tree about which I commanded you, "You must not eat from it," "Cursed is the ground because of you; through painful toil you will eat food from it all the days of your life.
18 It will produce thorns and thistles for you, and you will eat the plants of the field.
19 By the sweat of your brow you will eat your foo until you return to the ground, since from it you were taken for dust you are and to dust you will return."

Genesis 3:24 After he drove the man out, he placed on the east side of the Garden of Eden cherubim and a flaming sword flashing back and forth to guard the way to the tree of life.

They understand good and evil very well.

Sorry, I don"t see any good reason to believe that.

Man has managed with God for over 200, 000 years. The bible was only introduced by Moses in 1446BC . God only thought of sending Jesus 2000 years ago, evolutionists place modern man at 200,000 years ago.

Evil was already there in heaven before creation. That is where Satan learned of it. The battle of angels began in heaven. It was Satan aka talking serpent that talked Adam and Eve into eating the fruit.

There is nothing evil in heaven. When Satan rejected God, he was cast out of heaven.

Satan was evil in heaven that is why he was cast out of heaven. Satan was rebelling against God. Rebellion is evil and it started in heaven.

We cannot help it, we are all gods.we were created in his image, in the image of a God.

John 10:34 Jesus answered them, "Is it not written in your Law, 'I have said you are "gods"'?

But don"t you think image is less than the object of an image? Or would you pay same price for a picture of a car as for actual car? And John 10:34 is not saying that all people are gods, it is referring to scripture in the OT that speaks of gods.

Jesus said if you saw me you saw my father. Image is resemblance, representation of the person.

John 14:9 Jesus answered: "Don't you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, 'Show us the Father'?

Isaiah described Jesus as real ugly.

Isaiah 53:3 He was despised and rejected by mankind, a man of suffering, and familiar with pain. Like one from whom people hide their faces he was despised, and we held him in low esteem.

Scriptures tell us God never allowed anyone to see his face. But we know what Jesus looked like and according to Jesus if you saw Jesus's ugly face you saw God's ugly face.

John 1:18 No one has ever seen God, but the one and only Son, who is himself God and is in closest relationship with the Father, has made him known. -

God presides in the great assembly. He judges among the gods.
Psalms 82:1

And the point is, some high person were called gods in the Bible.

The only evil we learnt was what God put in the tree of knowledge of good and evil. We had no other source for that knowledge.

Evil is actually same as rejecting God, or living without God. People could have asked that same directly from God, but now, they wanted to become gods that is why I think they chose the harder path.

But Adam and Eve never rejected God. God rejected them. it was God who drove them out of the garden.

Genesis 3:24 After he drove the man out, he placed on the east side of the Garden of Eden cherubim and a flaming sword flashing back and forth to guard the way to the tree of life.

But Jesus did not show the path to the tree of life. He pointed instead to his body. But his body is no longer here. And one has to eat his flesh and drink his blood to have eternal life because he was offering his real flesh and real blood. But he cannot do that anymore as a dead Jewish rabbi that was nailed to a wooden cross 2000 years ago.

John 6: 54 Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day. 55 For my flesh is real food and my blood is real drink.

But I think you understand wrongly what his flesh means, because John 6 continues with this:

It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh is useless. The words that I have spoken to you are spirit and are life.
John 6:63

He tried to change his message when he found they didn't like his ideas about cannibalising him.

John 6:61 Aware that his disciples were grumbling about this, Jesus said to them, "Does this offend you? 62 Then what if you see the Son of Man ascend to where he was before! 63 The Spirit gives life; the flesh counts for nothing. The words I have spoken to you"they are full of the Spirit[e] and life.

But many were disgusted with Jesus suggesting cannibalism and no longer followed him.

John 6:66 From this time many of his disciples turned back and no longer followed him

And nobody actually ate the physical flesh of Jesus, which I think blatantly proves it was not about the physical body of Jesus.

The were disgusted and walked out before accepting his offer. Jesus said he was offering real flesh and real blood. You cannot get more real than John 6:55

John 6: 55 For my flesh is real food and my blood is real drink.
12_13
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3/19/2017 10:57:56 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/17/2017 10:36:40 PM, Harikrish wrote:
You missed my post #8 which includes verses where God's punishes Adam, Eve and the Serpent.

I did not, I just don"t see that as a punishment, when people freely chose it.

Genesis 3:22 And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and live forever.

And I think it was good decision. Eternal life is good only for righteous people. Unrighteous people would turn eternal life into eternal hell for everyone.

Man has managed with God for over 200, 000 years. The bible was only introduced by Moses in 1446BC . God only thought of sending Jesus 2000 years ago, evolutionists place modern man at 200,000 years ago.

Sorry, I don"t believe that 200 000 years is correct fact. It is only a "scientific" opinion.

Satan was evil in heaven that is why he was cast out of heaven. Satan was rebelling against God. Rebellion is evil and it started in heaven.

Sorry, I have no reason to think Satan was evil in heaven. It is possible that at that moment when Satan rejected God, he was not in heaven or that just at that moment he was cast out of heaven so that nothing evil existed in heaven.

Jesus said if you saw me you saw my father. Image is resemblance, representation of the person.

But person is much more than physical appearance. According to the Bible, God is spirit. Image of Spirit is then also spiritual, not physical.

God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth.
John 4:24

Isaiah described Jesus as real ugly.

Isaiah 53:3 He was despised and rejected by mankind, a man of suffering, and familiar with pain. Like one from whom people hide their faces he was despised, and we held him in low esteem.

That is not same as ugly face.

But Adam and Eve never rejected God. God rejected them. it was God who drove them out of the garden.

At the moment when they decided to eat the fruit, they rejected God and his word.

The were disgusted and walked out before accepting his offer. Jesus said he was offering real flesh and real blood. You cannot get more real than John 6:55
John 6: 55 For my flesh is real food and my blood is real drink.

To me it is clear that Jesus was not speaking of physical body. But perhaps you can"t hear it, if you are not disciple of Jesus:

But you don't believe, because you are not of my sheep, as I told you. My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me.
John 10:26-27
bulproof
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3/19/2017 11:08:13 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/19/2017 10:57:56 AM, 12_13 wrote:
I did not, I just don"t see that as a punishment, when people freely chose it.
Who chose what?
PureX
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3/19/2017 2:09:27 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
To those who cannot comprehend the artifice of story-telling, or the symbolic imagery involved in mythical story-telling, such stories will seem nonsensical. Like a child reading a Shakespeare play and assuming that the events and characters are 'real', rather then their being metaphors for ourselves.
Harikrish
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3/19/2017 2:17:36 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/19/2017 10:57:56 AM, 12_13 wrote:
At 3/17/2017 10:36:40 PM, Harikrish wrote:
You missed my post #8 which includes verses where God's punishes Adam, Eve and the Serpent.

I did not, I just don"t see that as a punishment, when people freely chose it.

You are not very educated. You don't understand the concept of reward and punishment. Parents reward or punish their children to influence certain behaviour. God punished Adam and Eve when they chose to eat the 'forbidden' fruit. He certainly did not reward them with his curse.

Genesis 3:22 And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and live forever.

And I think it was good decision. Eternal life is good only for righteous people. Unrighteous people would turn eternal life into eternal hell for everyone.

So God was worried that Man having become like him could also live forever like him if he was also allowed to eat from the tree of life.

Man has managed with God for over 200, 000 years. The bible was only introduced by Moses in 1446BC . God only thought of sending Jesus 2000 years ago, evolutionists place modern man at 200,000 years ago.

Sorry, I don"t believe that 200 000 years is correct fact. It is only a "scientific" opinion.

It is the only scientific opinion. The bible puts creation of man on the sixth day which would suggest man was created only 4000 years ago. Fossil remains prove 200,000 years.

Satan was evil in heaven that is why he was cast out of heaven. Satan was rebelling against God. Rebellion is evil and it started in heaven.

Sorry, I have no reason to think Satan was evil in heaven. It is possible that at that moment when Satan rejected God, he was not in heaven or that just at that moment he was cast out of heaven so that nothing evil existed in heaven.

Satan was already evil in the Garden of Eden before the creation of the Adam and Eve. His first action was to corrupt Eve.

Jesus said if you saw me you saw my father. Image is resemblance, representation of the person.

But person is much more than physical appearance. According to the Bible, God is spirit. Image of Spirit is then also spiritual, not physical.

Yes, but we know what his physical appearance was based on Jesus's words.

God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth.
John 4:24

That is how God wants to be worshipped. It says nothing about his appearance.

Isaiah described Jesus as real ugly.

Isaiah 53:3 He was despised and rejected by mankind, a man of suffering, and familiar with pain. Like one from whom people hide their faces he was despised, and we held him in low esteem.

That is not same as ugly face.

He was so ugly no one could bear to even look at him.

But Adam and Eve never rejected God. God rejected them. it was God who drove them out of the garden.

At the moment when they decided to eat the fruit, they rejected God and his word.

They did not reject God. They ignored his warning not to eat the fruit for they would surely die.

The were disgusted and walked out before accepting his offer. Jesus said he was offering real flesh and real blood. You cannot get more real than John 6:55
John 6: 55 For my flesh is real food and my blood is real drink.

To me it is clear that Jesus was not speaking of physical body. But perhaps you can"t hear it, if you are not disciple of Jesus:

You can't hear it either. You have to read what is written in the verse. Jesus said:":John 6: 55 For my flesh is real food and my blood is real drink."

But you don't believe, because you are not of my sheep, as I told you. My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me.
John 10:26-27

Sheep don't understand human communication. Jesus never had sheep, he was a carpenter's son and not a shepherd.
Ludofl3x
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3/19/2017 2:58:23 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/19/2017 2:09:27 PM, PureX wrote:
To those who cannot comprehend the artifice of story-telling, or the symbolic imagery involved in mythical story-telling, such stories will seem nonsensical. Like a child reading a Shakespeare play and assuming that the events and characters are 'real', rather then their being metaphors for ourselves.

Except no one comes to your door telling you to accept that they are real, or perish in a lake of fire. No one is voting for anyone based on if that pergonomic thinks the same Shakespeare plays they like are the best most correct ones. No one is using Shakespeare to base discrimination upon. No one is giving tax breaks to the people who think twelfth n night is more real than midsummer nights dream. No one is hunting down the descendants of mercutio because of what the play says about him and romeo. No one is standing at afuneral yelling King Lear hates gays. And once you decide is a story and not to be taken literally, you can no longer g take any of it literally. Suddenly, you have to think for yourself, if it's all just a book of fables.
PureX
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3/20/2017 3:07:41 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/19/2017 2:58:23 PM, Ludofl3x wrote:
At 3/19/2017 2:09:27 PM, PureX wrote:
To those who cannot comprehend the artifice of story-telling, or the symbolic imagery involved in mythical story-telling, such stories will seem nonsensical. Like a child reading a Shakespeare play and assuming that the events and characters are 'real', rather then their being metaphors for ourselves.

Except no one comes to your door telling you to accept that they are real, or perish in a lake of fire.

Why would you listen to adults that have no more understanding of the Bible than small children, and have no interest in increasing their understanding?

The thread asks is the Bible makes sense. And the Bible does make sense, but it's a collection of mythical literature, so one has to learn HOW to make sense of it. If one is not willing to do that, then it will appear nonsensical whether you "believe in" it or not.

No one is voting for anyone based on if that pergonomic thinks the same Shakespeare plays they like are the best most correct ones. No one is using Shakespeare to base discrimination upon. No one is giving tax breaks to the people who think twelfth n night is more real than midsummer nights dream. No one is hunting down the descendants of mercutio because of what the play says about him and romeo. No one is standing at afuneral yelling King Lear hates gays. And once you decide is a story and not to be taken literally, you can no longer g take any of it literally. Suddenly, you have to think for yourself, if it's all just a book of fables.

And no one can control the willful ignorance of others. Certainly not by validating it. And you just validating it when you treat the text in the same ignorant manner as they do.
CosmoJarvis
Posts: 1,078
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3/20/2017 5:58:27 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
The Bible is false and ridiculous. There's no scientific evidence to prove it, unless you believe in the Christian apologists who present skewed interpretations of the Bible to prove that there are scientific grounds in the Bible.

Some claims about how the Bible is true are made by people who haven't even read the Bible, yet choose to assume that because they've been raised by that religion or go through some life-changing event which seems to surreal to label as "natural," instead assuming it to be the result of something "divine" or "Godly."

Though I do not recall the person's name, a person on the forums said that he thought that the Noah's Ark story was a ploy to see how gullible people are; a test per-say. This really sums up the Bible; some ridiculous amalgamation of texts written by multiple authors in a period ranging between hundreds of years that are read, admired and considered sacred to gullible theists.
"fake and gay" -Vaarka
"Submit to the soy or be annihilated." -Thett3
12_13
Posts: 2,575
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3/20/2017 10:20:48 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/19/2017 2:17:36 PM, Harikrish wrote:
You are not very educated. You don't understand the concept of reward and punishment. Parents reward or punish their children to influence certain behaviour. God punished Adam and Eve when they chose to eat the 'forbidden' fruit. He certainly did not reward them with his curse.

I disagree with that, they wanted to know evil, so God made them know it as they wanted. It is really stupid to think knowing evil wouldn"t mean anything.

It is the only scientific opinion. The bible puts creation of man on the sixth day which would suggest man was created only 4000 years ago. Fossil remains prove 200,000 years.

4000 years may be wrongly calculated, but truth is, fossil remains doesn"t prove 200000 years, it is only a belief.

Satan was already evil in the Garden of Eden before the creation of the Adam and Eve. His first action was to corrupt Eve.

I don"t think Garden of Eden is heaven.
IsMyCoreRecorded4Transfer
Posts: 23
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3/21/2017 12:02:12 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/16/2017 9:02:49 PM, Harikrish wrote:
After creating Adam and Eve. God tells them they can eat from any tree in the garden except one.

Genesis 2:17 but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat from it you will certainly die."

What happens when they disobey God and eat the forbidden fruit?

Genesis 3:22 And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life firever.

They become like him and now he does not want them to live forever.

So what does God do? He punishes Adam and Eve for disobeying him.


Genesis 3: 14 So the Lord God said to the serpent, "Because you have done this, "Cursed are you above all livestock and all wild animals. You will crawl on your belly and you will eat dust all the days of your life.
15 And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring[a] and hers; he will crush[b] your head, and you will strike his heel."
16 To the woman he said, "I will make your pains in childbearing very severe; with painful labor you will give birth to children. Your desire will be for your husband, and he will rule over you."
17 To Adam he said, "Because you listened to your wife and ate fruit from the tree about which I commanded you, "You must not eat from it," "Cursed is the ground because of you; through painful toil you will eat food from it all the days of your life.
18 It will produce thorns and thistles for you, and you will eat the plants of the field.
19 By the sweat of your brow you will eat your foo until you return to the ground, since from it you were taken for dust you are and to dust you will return."

The rest of the bible is about God sending prophets to teach the people what is good and evil and laws they should obey. Why?

Odd that God is asking them to learn the difference between good and evil when he punished Adam and Eve for eating the forbidden fruit because they were desirous of gaining wisdom of good and evil. God was against them learning then in the Garden. Now he sends prophets to teach them and wonders why they are reluctant to learn forgetting he punished them when they wanted to learn.

Genesis 3:6 When the woman saw that the fruit of the tree was good for food and pleasing to the eye, and also desirable for gaining wisdom, she took some and ate it. She also gave some to her husband, who was with her, and he ate it.

Because Adam and Eve gained the knowledge and became like Him, God did not want them to also live forever. So he banished them from the garden and had angels guard the tree of life.

So why did he send his only begotten son Jesus?


John 3:16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

But it was God who took away the tree of life so they would not live forever. Now he is offering Jesus to restore what he took away from them Ie the tree of life.

God suffers from circular reasoning/logic. The bible only makes sense if you suffer from the same condition.
Circular reasoning (Latin: circulus in probando, "circle in proving"; also known as circular logic) is a logical fallacy in which the reasoner begins with what they are trying to end with. The components of a circular argument are often logically valid because if the premises are true, the conclusion must be true.

In short, God is trying to restore his creation back to Paradise which he took away from Adam and Eve for disobeying him by desiring what he wanted them to learn anyways.

Only a fool would view the bible as literal or actual events; it's just a story to help put things into perspective - and then, you, the new age, took everything out of context.

Seen a guy here who really thought that 'the flood' had something to do with actual water on earth.

Grow up.

The flood means everyone was drowning. Water. No, not literally drowning - drowning as in "I'm drowning in my work tonight" or "I feel like I'm drowning".

Don't ever speak literal about the bible again.

Ever. Got it?

I'm sick of this 'God'.

Explain to your fruckin' people, God.....or I will....
Harikrish
Posts: 39,173
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3/21/2017 12:33:41 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/20/2017 10:20:48 PM, 12_13 wrote:
At 3/19/2017 2:17:36 PM, Harikrish wrote:
You are not very educated. You don't understand the concept of reward and punishment. Parents reward or punish their children to influence certain behaviour. God punished Adam and Eve when they chose to eat the 'forbidden' fruit. He certainly did not reward them with his curse.

I disagree with that, they wanted to know evil, so God made them know it as they wanted. It is really stupid to think knowing evil wouldn"t mean anything.


You are scripturally ignorant. God did not want them to eat of the tree of knowledge of good and evil.

Genesis 2:17 but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat from it you will certainly die."

You have to read what the scriptures tells us about God's reaction was when he found out what had happened.

Genesis 3: 14 So the Lord God said to the serpent, "Because you have done this, "Cursed are you above all livestock and all wild animals. You will crawl on your belly and you will eat dust all the days of your life.
15 And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring[a] and hers; he will crush[b] your head, and you will strike his heel."
16 To the woman he said, "I will make your pains in childbearing very severe; with painful labor you will give birth to children. Your desire will be for your husband, and he will rule over you."
17 To Adam he said, "Because you listened to your wife and ate fruit from the tree about which I commanded you, "You must not eat from it," "Cursed is the ground because of you; through painful toil you will eat food from it all the days of your life.
18 It will produce thorns and thistles for you, and you will eat the plants of the field.
19 By the sweat of your brow you will eat your foo until you return to the ground, since from it you were taken for dust you are and to dust you will return."

Genesis 3:24 After he drove the man out, he placed on the east side of the Garden of Eden cherubim and a flaming sword flashing back and forth to guard the way to the tree of life.

And why was he so upset. They he become like him

Genesis 3:22 And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life forever.

It is the only scientific opinion. The bible puts creation of man on the sixth day which would suggest man was created only 4000 years ago. Fossil remains prove 200,000 years.

4000 years may be wrongly calculated, but truth is, fossil remains doesn"t prove 200000 years, it is only a belief.

Science is not based on belief. It is the systematic study of the structure and behavior of the physical and natural world through observation and experiment.

You are very stupid for your age. His long have you been stuck on stupid.

Satan was already evil in the Garden of Eden before the creation of the Adam and Eve. His first action was to corrupt Eve.

I don"t think Garden of Eden is heaven.
No it is not. But he was in heaven before creation as an angel called Lucifer/Satan. Satan was already evil before creation of the world and the garden of Eden. The serpent came prepared to influence Adam and Eve. He did not learn evil in the Garden.
Harikrish
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3/21/2017 1:03:48 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/21/2017 12:02:12 PM, IsMyCoreRecorded4Transfer wrote:
At 3/16/2017 9:02:49 PM, Harikrish wrote:
After creating Adam and Eve. God tells them they can eat from any tree in the garden except one.

Genesis 2:17 but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat from it you will certainly die."

What happens when they disobey God and eat the forbidden fruit?

Genesis 3:22 And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life firever.

They become like him and now he does not want them to live forever.

So what does God do? He punishes Adam and Eve for disobeying him.


Genesis 3: 14 So the Lord God said to the serpent, "Because you have done this, "Cursed are you above all livestock and all wild animals. You will crawl on your belly and you will eat dust all the days of your life.
15 And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring[a] and hers; he will crush[b] your head, and you will strike his heel."
16 To the woman he said, "I will make your pains in childbearing very severe; with painful labor you will give birth to children. Your desire will be for your husband, and he will rule over you."
17 To Adam he said, "Because you listened to your wife and ate fruit from the tree about which I commanded you, "You must not eat from it," "Cursed is the ground because of you; through painful toil you will eat food from it all the days of your life.
18 It will produce thorns and thistles for you, and you will eat the plants of the field.
19 By the sweat of your brow you will eat your foo until you return to the ground, since from it you were taken for dust you are and to dust you will return."

The rest of the bible is about God sending prophets to teach the people what is good and evil and laws they should obey. Why?

Odd that God is asking them to learn the difference between good and evil when he punished Adam and Eve for eating the forbidden fruit because they were desirous of gaining wisdom of good and evil. God was against them learning then in the Garden. Now he sends prophets to teach them and wonders why they are reluctant to learn forgetting he punished them when they wanted to learn.

Genesis 3:6 When the woman saw that the fruit of the tree was good for food and pleasing to the eye, and also desirable for gaining wisdom, she took some and ate it. She also gave some to her husband, who was with her, and he ate it.

Because Adam and Eve gained the knowledge and became like Him, God did not want them to also live forever. So he banished them from the garden and had angels guard the tree of life.

So why did he send his only begotten son Jesus?


John 3:16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

But it was God who took away the tree of life so they would not live forever. Now he is offering Jesus to restore what he took away from them Ie the tree of life.

God suffers from circular reasoning/logic. The bible only makes sense if you suffer from the same condition.
Circular reasoning (Latin: circulus in probando, "circle in proving"; also known as circular logic) is a logical fallacy in which the reasoner begins with what they are trying to end with. The components of a circular argument are often logically valid because if the premises are true, the conclusion must be true.

In short, God is trying to restore his creation back to Paradise which he took away from Adam and Eve for disobeying him by desiring what he wanted them to learn anyways.

Only a fool would view the bible as literal or actual events; it's just a story to help put things into perspective - and then, you, the new age, took everything out of context.

You are the only fool here to be upset about a story that helps to put things into perspective.

Seen a guy here who really thought that 'the flood' had something to do with actual water on earth.

Flood by definition is an overflowing of a large amount of water beyond its normal confines, especially over what is normally dry land.

Grow up.

Last words you remember before your mommy flushed you down the toilet.

The flood means everyone was drowning. Water. No, not literally drowning - drowning as in "I'm drowning in my work tonight" or "I feel like I'm drowning".

Flood by definition is an overflowing of a large amount of water beyond its normal confines, especially over what is normally dry land.

Don't ever speak literal about the bible again.

Why, are you going to stick your head in the toilet and flush?

Ever. Got it?

No, retards like you are largely ignored.

I'm sick of this 'God'.

You should be. He turned you into a freak.

Explain to your fruckin' people, God.....or I will....

You said you are sick of this God. Now you are insisting God has to be explained. Then you want to do the explaining.
12_13
Posts: 2,575
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3/21/2017 9:01:24 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/21/2017 12:33:41 PM, Harikrish wrote:
You are scripturally ignorant. God did not want them to eat of the tree of knowledge of good and evil.

And I didn"t even claim that God wanted them to eat the fruit. But knowledge can be obtained also by asking directly from God, if you happen to be in the presence of God as Adam and Eve were.

You have to read what the scriptures tells us about God's reaction was when he found out what had happened.

Yeah, I have done that.

And why was he so upset. They he become like him

He was "upset", because of what they did.

Science is not based on belief. It is the systematic study of the structure and behavior of the physical and natural world through observation and experiment.

Actually, all knowledge depends on belief, if you don"t believe the knowledge, it is no knowledge to you. But I can agree that real science is systematic study. And real science has nothing against the Bible.

Satan was already evil before creation of the world and the garden of Eden.

Why should I believe that?
Face-of-the-deep
Posts: 80
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3/25/2017 4:19:55 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
In short, God is trying to restore his creation back to Paradise which he took away from Adam and Eve for disobeying him by desiring what he wanted them to learn anyways.

Only a fool would view the bible as literal or actual events; it's just a story to help put things into perspective - and then, you, the new age, took everything out of context.

Seen a guy here who really thought that 'the flood' had something to do with actual water on earth.

Grow up.

The flood means everyone was drowning. Water. No, not literally drowning - drowning as in "I'm drowning in my work tonight" or "I feel like I'm drowning".

Don't ever speak literal about the bible again.

Ever. Got it?

I'm sick of this 'God'.

Explain to your fruckin' people, God.....or I will....

Trying to explain that the Bible is a spiritual collection of stories is usually a waste of time. Reading in the spirit and reading in the flesh are totally different things. People who take the Bible as literal or an account of history, is useless and futile. The word is God and God is the word, anyone who doesn't know that should retake communication 101. There is no all powerful (sky pixie) controlling stuff. The word, makes the kingdom of Heaven on earth, daily.
Harikrish
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3/26/2017 4:12:50 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/21/2017 9:01:24 PM, 12_13 wrote:
At 3/21/2017 12:33:41 PM, Harikrish wrote:
You are scripturally ignorant. God did not want them to eat of the tree of knowledge of good and evil.

And I didn"t even claim that God wanted them to eat the fruit. But knowledge can be obtained also by asking directly from God, if you happen to be in the presence of God as Adam and Eve were.

God did not live in the Garden with Adm nod Eve. He gave them instructions and left.
But he did put the knowledge of good and evil into a tree.

Genesis 2:16-17, "And the LORD God commanded the man, "You are free to eat from any tree in the garden; but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat of it you will surely die.""

You have to read what the scriptures tells us about God's reaction was when he found out what had happened.

Yeah, I have done that.

And why was he so upset. They become like him very knowledgeable

He was "upset", because of what they did.

And what they did was acquire the knowledge of good and evil. The bible is full of attempts by God to teach man the difference between good and evil. He even sent prophets and his own son Jesus to teach man what was good and what was evil. But Adam and Eve having been punished by God for acquiring the knowledge of good and evil created a genetic revulsion and avoidance for such knowledge. Any wonder why the Jews resisted the prophets and Jesus because they saw this as another trap to force them to learn what was good and evil only to be punished again like Adam and Eve.
Fool me once shame on God. Fool me twice shame on man.

Science is not based on belief. It is the systematic study of the structure and behavior of the physical and natural world through observation and experiment.

Actually, all knowledge depends on belief, if you don"t believe the knowledge, it is no knowledge to you. But I can agree that real science is systematic study. And real science has nothing against the Bible.

The bible has failed scientific scrutiny. Archeological discoveries demolishes the Bible proving the characters in the bible were fictional character. There was no Exodus. The kingdom of David and Solomon was just some tiny little cow town. Even Jesus was a deluded Jewish rabbi who was crucified by the Romans.

Satan was already evil before creation of the world and the garden of Eden.

Why should I believe that?
Because God lied when he said he put the knowledge of good and evil into a tree. But scriptures tell us he and the angels in Heaven already had the knowledge of good and evil.

Genesis 3:22 And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life, and live forever.
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 25,687
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3/26/2017 5:59:00 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/16/2017 9:02:49 PM, Harikrish wrote:
After creating Adam and Eve. God tells them they can eat from any tree in the garden except one.

Genesis 2:17 but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat from it you will certainly die."

What happens when they disobey God and eat the forbidden fruit?

Genesis 3:22 And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life firever.

They become like him and now he does not want them to live forever.

So what does God do? He punishes Adam and Eve for disobeying him.


Genesis 3: 14 So the Lord God said to the serpent, "Because you have done this, "Cursed are you above all livestock and all wild animals. You will crawl on your belly and you will eat dust all the days of your life.
15 And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring[a] and hers; he will crush[b] your head, and you will strike his heel."
16 To the woman he said, "I will make your pains in childbearing very severe; with painful labor you will give birth to children. Your desire will be for your husband, and he will rule over you."
17 To Adam he said, "Because you listened to your wife and ate fruit from the tree about which I commanded you, "You must not eat from it," "Cursed is the ground because of you; through painful toil you will eat food from it all the days of your life.
18 It will produce thorns and thistles for you, and you will eat the plants of the field.
19 By the sweat of your brow you will eat your foo until you return to the ground, since from it you were taken for dust you are and to dust you will return."

The rest of the bible is about God sending prophets to teach the people what is good and evil and laws they should obey. Why?

Odd that God is asking them to learn the difference between good and evil when he punished Adam and Eve for eating the forbidden fruit because they were desirous of gaining wisdom of good and evil. God was against them learning then in the Garden. Now he sends prophets to teach them and wonders why they are reluctant to learn forgetting he punished them when they wanted to learn.

Genesis 3:6 When the woman saw that the fruit of the tree was good for food and pleasing to the eye, and also desirable for gaining wisdom, she took some and ate it. She also gave some to her husband, who was with her, and he ate it.

Because Adam and Eve gained the knowledge and became like Him, God did not want them to also live forever. So he banished them from the garden and had angels guard the tree of life.

So why did he send his only begotten son Jesus?


John 3:16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

But it was God who took away the tree of life so they would not live forever. Now he is offering Jesus to restore what he took away from them Ie the tree of life.

God suffers from circular reasoning/logic. The bible only makes sense if you suffer from the same condition.
Circular reasoning (Latin: circulus in probando, "circle in proving"; also known as circular logic) is a logical fallacy in which the reasoner begins with what they are trying to end with. The components of a circular argument are often logically valid because if the premises are true, the conclusion must be true.

In short, God is trying to restore his creation back to Paradise which he took away from Adam and Eve for disobeying him by desiring what he wanted them to learn anyways.

The simple answer is that to those of us who take the trouble to learn what it really says it is the most rational, logical, book ever written.
It impossible to make a horse drink which is not thirsty, or eat if it is not hungry.

Likewise it is impossible to teach a person who does not wish to learn. Matthew 13:15.
Harikrish
Posts: 39,173
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3/26/2017 9:04:58 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/26/2017 5:59:00 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 3/16/2017 9:02:49 PM, Harikrish wrote:
After creating Adam and Eve. God tells them they can eat from any tree in the garden except one.

Genesis 2:17 but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat from it you will certainly die."

What happens when they disobey God and eat the forbidden fruit?

Genesis 3:22 And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life firever.

They become like him and now he does not want them to live forever.

So what does God do? He punishes Adam and Eve for disobeying him.


Genesis 3: 14 So the Lord God said to the serpent, "Because you have done this, "Cursed are you above all livestock and all wild animals. You will crawl on your belly and you will eat dust all the days of your life.
15 And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring[a] and hers; he will crush[b] your head, and you will strike his heel."
16 To the woman he said, "I will make your pains in childbearing very severe; with painful labor you will give birth to children. Your desire will be for your husband, and he will rule over you."
17 To Adam he said, "Because you listened to your wife and ate fruit from the tree about which I commanded you, "You must not eat from it," "Cursed is the ground because of you; through painful toil you will eat food from it all the days of your life.
18 It will produce thorns and thistles for you, and you will eat the plants of the field.
19 By the sweat of your brow you will eat your foo until you return to the ground, since from it you were taken for dust you are and to dust you will return."

The rest of the bible is about God sending prophets to teach the people what is good and evil and laws they should obey. Why?

Odd that God is asking them to learn the difference between good and evil when he punished Adam and Eve for eating the forbidden fruit because they were desirous of gaining wisdom of good and evil. God was against them learning then in the Garden. Now he sends prophets to teach them and wonders why they are reluctant to learn forgetting he punished them when they wanted to learn.

Genesis 3:6 When the woman saw that the fruit of the tree was good for food and pleasing to the eye, and also desirable for gaining wisdom, she took some and ate it. She also gave some to her husband, who was with her, and he ate it.

Because Adam and Eve gained the knowledge and became like Him, God did not want them to also live forever. So he banished them from the garden and had angels guard the tree of life.

So why did he send his only begotten son Jesus?


John 3:16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

But it was God who took away the tree of life so they would not live forever. Now he is offering Jesus to restore what he took away from them Ie the tree of life.

God suffers from circular reasoning/logic. The bible only makes sense if you suffer from the same condition.
Circular reasoning (Latin: circulus in probando, "circle in proving"; also known as circular logic) is a logical fallacy in which the reasoner begins with what they are trying to end with. The components of a circular argument are often logically valid because if the premises are true, the conclusion must be true.

In short, God is trying to restore his creation back to Paradise which he took away from Adam and Eve for disobeying him by desiring what he wanted them to learn anyways.

The simple answer is that to those of us who take the trouble to learn what it really says it is the most rational, logical, book ever written.

You call the Bibke the most rational logical book ever written because it has:
1. A Talking serpent that outwitted God
2. Trees created with the knowledge of good and evil before humans acquired that knowledge.
3. Trees created that made anyone eating it immortal.
4. Dead Jews offered atonement for sins. Jesus was a Jew that was offered as human sacrifice to atone for sins.
5. After you are baptized sexual immorality, adultery, child abandonment and other egregious sins are not sins any more. A different standard is applied called not guilty by reason of insanity.
6. Catholics are wrong in their beliefs . but sleeping with them is acceptable.
Skeptical1
Posts: 1,758
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3/26/2017 9:28:57 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Does the bible make sense?

Is the Pope Jewish?
Ethang5: Children cannot be morons.
Skeptical1: The only thing you have demonstrated is they don't have a monopoly on it.
MasonicSlayer
Posts: 3,649
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3/26/2017 10:46:02 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/26/2017 9:28:57 PM, Skeptical1 wrote:
Does the bible make sense?

Is the Pope Jewish?

I don't know. I know an atheist who tells me he is Jewish and I'm like, how is that even possible(?) He's looking at me like it's a stupid question and I'm pretty much thinking the same because how can you be Jewish and an atheist unless he married and atheist maybe. There might be some wiggle room there if God starts asking about it.
Harikrish
Posts: 39,173
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3/27/2017 2:09:14 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/26/2017 10:46:02 PM, MasonicSlayer wrote:
At 3/26/2017 9:28:57 PM, Skeptical1 wrote:
Does the bible make sense?

Is the Pope Jewish?

I don't know. I know an atheist who tells me he is Jewish and I'm like, how is that even possible(?) He's looking at me like it's a stupid question and I'm pretty much thinking the same because how can you be Jewish and an atheist unless he married and atheist maybe. There might be some wiggle room there if God starts asking about it.

You should be surprised there aren't most Jews turning atheist after 1500 years of persecution and expulsion. If God picked a people that wouldn't quit on him he picked right when he picked the Jews. Too bad you are a holocaust denier.

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