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Fatal Attraction Mafia DP3

Wylted
Posts: 25,970
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6/4/2017 6:54:43 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
Lynched Last DP

Cosmo- He was Innocent

Committed Suicide Last DP

Subutai- He was Innocent

Karla Holmoka- sub
Paul Bernardo- cosmo

Meeting- At 17 Karla met 23 year old Paul in a pet convention, where they had sex the same night, and soon discovered they shared many of the same sadomasochistic tendencies.

Relationship- With the encouragement of Karla Paul became known as the "Scarborough rapist". Paul would often anally rape his victims and torture them. The two developed a master slave relationship, with Karla aiming to please all of Paul's desires.

Victims- Paul always hated that Karla was not a virgin when they met. Karla wanting to please Paul, and regretting she could not give him her own virginity, offered up her 15 year old sister's virginity. Karla's job as a at a vet clinic allowed her to steal the anesthetic Halothane. On December 23 at a family Christmas party, Karla and Paul used the anesthetic to drug Tammy (the 15 year old sister). Paul raped Tammy while Karla videotaped. During the rape Tammy choked on her vomit and died. When the police arrived, they detected no foul play, and ruled the death an accident. Soon their crimes escalated. Karla would seduce dozens of young girls to a location where the couple would rape, torture and kill their victims while videotaping their crimes.

Capture- The couple separated after Paul began to abuse Karla. During this separation police were closing in on "Scarborough Rapist", and soon would have the DNA evidence to link Paul to the rapes. Karla was called in and questioned by the police because a Mickey Mouse watch she owned was found on one of the victims. Karla sensing the gig was about to be up, contacted a lawyer. Shortly afterwords she painted herself as a battered wife and exposed her husband as a serial killer. The cops thinking she was an unwilling and reluctant participant agreed to a plea bargain of 12 years, where she would be eligible for parole in just 3 short years. The police regretted their decision when videotapes surfaced later on showing that Karla was very much an active participant, and enjoyed rape and torture just as much, if not more than her husband.

Postscript- Paul is spending the rest of his life in prison, but Karla was freed in 2005. Karla now goes by the name Leanne Teale, and lives in Chateauguay Quebec, She lives in a nice 2 story cottage, and is happily married with 3 children.

Actually to be specific if anyone wants to do society a favor. She lives at 16 Rue Beauchamp Street in Montreal QC J6J 2K4 with husband Thierry Bordelais and their 3 biological offspring Noah 10, Aurelie 6 & Loic 4.

Graveyard

Khaos1 (town)
Forever23 (mafia)
Cosmo Kramer (town)
Subutai (town)

Living players

1. Sui Generis
2. Annie
3. Warren
4. Subutai2 (replacing Zarroette, pending confirmation)
5. LikeMagic
6. Danielle
7. VelCrow
8. Tuf
9. Skep
10. Unstobbaple

With 10 players alive it takes 6 votes to lynch before the deadline of 3 AM Eastern time 6-9-17.
Chaos88
Posts: 4,097
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6/4/2017 11:33:46 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
Arghh!!!! What the hell man.....seriously, what the hell is up with players who troll games. I knew I shouldn't have replaced back in.

I've got school work and job hunt stuff to focus on this weekend, and I saw I had a lot of pending responses. Feel free to ping this response this DP to get answers to things you needed.

So, some thoughts, and if they were addressed, can you please respond with post numbers:
1. Has Dani explained why Velcrow is town read by her yet?
2. Has Unstoppable or Sui posted anything that suggests they are town last DP?
3. Has Velcrow?
4. As long as we have one mutually agreed town pair alive, we can rush every DP, since mafia can only win by being alive in a surviving pair. I advocate rushing the next two DPs. I recommend Unstoppable and Velcrow, unless there were developments I missed. If a different wagon forms (other than my own, since I firmly believe Warren is town, and will not reassess until a much later day phase), I'll hop on to hammer. I don't really care who is lynched these next two DPs as long as it is done quickly. Just ping me.

VTL Unstop
Chaos88
Posts: 4,097
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6/4/2017 11:48:50 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
Unless things have changed last DP that I missed, I town read Skep, Warren, LM, and Dani the most, in that order. Sui could be town, due to his insipid responses, but he's been largely anti-town this game, and I don't recall him posting much last DP, and I also see that he avoided posting in this game, but posted on the games forum. TUF is null, since he's mad at me, and, to be honest, when I reread that PM, I think I'm mad at him a bit, so I can't really read him. Sub2 is null, obviously. So, if this were a regular game, I'd be advocating lynches of Unstop and Velcrow, in that order, for their play so far.

The fact that lynching any of the players who are not town read means I also lose a player I do town read frustrates me, and I've discovered it is a weakness to my tactical play lol

It is an annoying aspect to the game, and a major reason why I want to rush DPs, since I loathe the prospect, and don't want to languish with the decisions. That, plus the fact there are anti-town players and inactives that need replacing, and they all can't be scum.........
TUF
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6/4/2017 12:20:45 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/4/2017 11:33:46 AM, Chaos88 wrote:
Arghh!!!! What the hell man.....seriously, what the hell is up with players who troll games. I knew I shouldn't have replaced back in.

To be fair, he did seem to be trying in the end to save himself. Just was too little too late, and ultimately the defeatist side earlier looked scummy.

4. As long as we have one mutually agreed town pair alive, we can rush every DP, since mafia can only win by being alive in a surviving pair. I advocate rushing the next two DPs. I recommend Unstoppable and Velcrow, unless there were developments I missed. If a different wagon forms (other than my own, since I firmly believe Warren is town, and will not reassess until a much later day phase), I'll hop on to hammer. I don't really care who is lynched these next two DPs as long as it is done quickly. Just ping me.

VTL Unstop

I don't see the logic in rushing a lynch and "Mutually agreeing on a town pair". I doubt anyone can mutually agree on that at this point. We have 5 days, lets use them to build better reads and find scum.
TUF
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6/4/2017 12:22:47 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/4/2017 11:48:50 AM, Chaos88 wrote:
TUF is null, since he's mad at me, and, to be honest, when I reread that PM, I think I'm mad at him a bit, so I can't really read him.

Wow bro. You literally ignored my monster post last phase responding to this, which I hoped would quell this issue. Now I am under the impression that you are drama-seeking.
TUF
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6/4/2017 12:25:43 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
I think skeps/zarro is a good place to start. He (skep) has to be among the lowest contributors of this game. He posts very occasionally and often get's forgotten about. Not to mention we haven't heard a word from his partner zarroette. With sub replacing her, we should be able read him as a clean slate.

VTL subutai2
Chaos88
Posts: 4,097
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6/4/2017 12:44:40 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/4/2017 12:20:45 PM, TUF wrote:
At 6/4/2017 11:33:46 AM, Chaos88 wrote:
Arghh!!!! What the hell man.....seriously, what the hell is up with players who troll games. I knew I shouldn't have replaced back in.

To be fair, he did seem to be trying in the end to save himself. Just was too little too late, and ultimately the defeatist side earlier looked scummy.


4. As long as we have one mutually agreed town pair alive, we can rush every DP, since mafia can only win by being alive in a surviving pair. I advocate rushing the next two DPs. I recommend Unstoppable and Velcrow, unless there were developments I missed. If a different wagon forms (other than my own, since I firmly believe Warren is town, and will not reassess until a much later day phase), I'll hop on to hammer. I don't really care who is lynched these next two DPs as long as it is done quickly. Just ping me.

VTL Unstop

I don't see the logic in rushing a lynch and "Mutually agreeing on a town pair". I doubt anyone can mutually agree on that at this point. We have 5 days, lets use them to build better reads and find scum.

Since mafia have to lynch ALL TOWN PAIRS, if everyone were agreed that a specific pair was town, we could just lynch the rest in any order and it doesn't matter - town will win. Mafia cannot have half the players if there is a living town pair. Ergo, since we know there is only two mafia left alive, we can rush DPs up to MYLO, unless MYLO is pushed back if we hit scum, which is a high possibility, and then we can rush even more DPs.

I don't want to wait nearly two weeks to get to a similar point to lynch my scum read. This game could be over in two weeks instead, as opposed to only being at potential MYLO (assuming we mislynch twice). The only value of delaying the DP at this point is to get a better read on Sui, Velcrow, Unstop, and Sub2, most of which is unnecessary, since the first three have made posts and their beds, and the latter isn't going to likely influence his potential scuminess, since he'll just rely on past reads, and I don't want to wait nearly a week to hopefully get a better idea of Sub's affiliation when he is already in the PoE pile. We have three lynches before we potentially lose, and I'd be down with rushing Unstop, Velcrow, Sub, and you. Obviously, since we only have three before we could lose, I would reassess after two, unless we hit scum. If we did hit scum, I'm on auto-pilot the rest of the game. That's how sure I am of my town reads.

You lack confidence in your reads, I do not. I firmly believe scum is in those four names. Make use of the DP; I'm a busy man. Just don't expect me to help much (even though I say this and I'm sure I'll poke in instead of doing what I should be.....). I am simply noting my preference to rush. Not like it matters, since we'll have to get a majority of players to agree, and three seem to be elsewhere, so it's not likely going to end quickly any time soon.

As far as the drama goes, I don't believe you yet. And, the fact you were drunk is a separate, personal issue. It's not a judgment of you in the least, but I got a personal issue with drinking (thanks to my father). I don't close at restaurants anymore because I can't stand the drunks. Not drama, just stating a fact and how it affects the game (i.e. my read). Nothing more than that. Do you want me to say that I scum read you and push for your lynch, even though my objectivity may be compromised?
warren42
Posts: 4,456
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6/4/2017 1:53:18 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
The dumbtelling got out of hand, and the sudden ability to comprehend and articulate struck me as scummy. Oh well.
Skepsikyma
Posts: 9,513
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6/4/2017 2:13:11 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
I'm interested in figuring out Subutai's affiliation as well.

VTL Subutai
"Partout ou vous verrez un autel, la se trouve la civilisation."
- Joseph de Maistre -

"Woe that I live in bitter days,
As God is setting like a sun
And in his place, as lord and slave,
Man raises forth his heinous throne."
- Translation of 'Rhyfel', by Hedd Wyn -

Virtutem videant intabescantque relicta
LikeMagic
Posts: 2,190
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6/4/2017 6:09:44 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
I really think TUF is likely scum and think he should be the lynch. He's not only misrepresenting and exaggerating facts, but it's very strange that he is making all of these arguments against me and is suggesting I am scummy but is unwilling to actually scum read me or lynch me for it. He has stated that I contrived a read on him, that I falsified an analysis, that I flip-flopped on him with no grounds to do so, and that my early scum read on him was WIFOM. If he believes these things there is no reason for him not to scum read me and be pushing my lynch if he's town. It's very odd.

VTL TUF
LikeMagic
Posts: 2,190
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6/4/2017 6:14:57 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/4/2017 11:33:46 AM, Chaos88 wrote:
Arghh!!!! What the hell man.....seriously, what the hell is up with players who troll games. I knew I shouldn't have replaced back in.

I've got school work and job hunt stuff to focus on this weekend, and I saw I had a lot of pending responses. Feel free to ping this response this DP to get answers to things you needed.

So, some thoughts, and if they were addressed, can you please respond with post numbers:
1. Has Dani explained why Velcrow is town read by her yet?
2. Has Unstoppable or Sui posted anything that suggests they are town last DP?
3. Has Velcrow?
4. As long as we have one mutually agreed town pair alive, we can rush every DP, since mafia can only win by being alive in a surviving pair. I advocate rushing the next two DPs. I recommend Unstoppable and Velcrow, unless there were developments I missed. If a different wagon forms (other than my own, since I firmly believe Warren is town, and will not reassess until a much later day phase), I'll hop on to hammer. I don't really care who is lynched these next two DPs as long as it is done quickly. Just ping me.

VTL Unstop

I think TUF should be the lynch. If you read the end of last DP he spent significant space arguing how fabricated my read was on him and that I was flip flopping and that my willingness to scum read was WIFOM, yet he wouldn't put a scum read on me and is not pushing my lynch. If I believed those things about a player they would be a top scum read and I would want them lynch. The way i see the only reason he has not to push my lynch is that he's scum. what are your thoughts?
LikeMagic
Posts: 2,190
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6/4/2017 6:21:23 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/4/2017 1:53:18 PM, warren42 wrote:
The dumbtelling got out of hand, and the sudden ability to comprehend and articulate struck me as scummy. Oh well.

What do you think of TUF's play in relation to me last DP. He was making all of these arguments to try and undermine my reads on him, suggesting I was fabricating and engaging in WIFOM, but refused to scum read me and is not advocating my lynch. This seems strange to me and likely scum motivated.
LikeMagic
Posts: 2,190
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6/4/2017 6:30:00 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/4/2017 2:13:11 PM, Skepsikyma wrote:
I'm interested in figuring out Subutai's affiliation as well.

VTL Subutai

Reads please. No more skating by.
Sui_Generis
Posts: 4,650
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6/4/2017 8:01:33 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
"avoided"

And Cosmo was quite obviously town. what a dumb lynch.
"How true it is that words are but vague shadows of the volumes we mean. Little audible links they are, chaining together great inaudible feelings and purposes."

"Nobody wants to be in your sig." ~Emilrose
TUF
Posts: 23,816
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6/4/2017 8:10:18 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/4/2017 12:44:40 PM, Chaos88 wrote:
At 6/4/2017 12:20:45 PM, TUF wrote:
At 6/4/2017 11:33:46 AM, Chaos88 wrote:
Arghh!!!! What the hell man.....seriously, what the hell is up with players who troll games. I knew I shouldn't have replaced back in.

To be fair, he did seem to be trying in the end to save himself. Just was too little too late, and ultimately the defeatist side earlier looked scummy.


4. As long as we have one mutually agreed town pair alive, we can rush every DP, since mafia can only win by being alive in a surviving pair. I advocate rushing the next two DPs. I recommend Unstoppable and Velcrow, unless there were developments I missed. If a different wagon forms (other than my own, since I firmly believe Warren is town, and will not reassess until a much later day phase), I'll hop on to hammer. I don't really care who is lynched these next two DPs as long as it is done quickly. Just ping me.

VTL Unstop

I don't see the logic in rushing a lynch and "Mutually agreeing on a town pair". I doubt anyone can mutually agree on that at this point. We have 5 days, lets use them to build better reads and find scum.

Since mafia have to lynch ALL TOWN PAIRS, if everyone were agreed that a specific pair was town, we could just lynch the rest in any order and it doesn't matter - town will win. Mafia cannot have half the players if there is a living town pair. Ergo, since we know there is only two mafia left alive, we can rush DPs up to MYLO, unless MYLO is pushed back if we hit scum, which is a high possibility, and then we can rush even more DPs.

We are not going to unanimously find town pairs. If we do and they are scum, we are shooting ourselves in the foot. Rushing the day phase is absurd.

I don't want to wait nearly two weeks to get to a similar point to lynch my scum read. This game could be over in two weeks instead, as opposed to only being at potential MYLO (assuming we mislynch twice). The only value of delaying the DP at this point is to get a better read on Sui, Velcrow, Unstop, and Sub2, most of which is unnecessary, since the first three have made posts and their beds, and the latter isn't going to likely influence his potential scuminess, since he'll just rely on past reads, and I don't want to wait nearly a week to hopefully get a better idea of Sub's affiliation when he is already in the PoE pile. We have three lynches before we potentially lose, and I'd be down with rushing Unstop, Velcrow, Sub, and you. Obviously, since we only have three before we could lose, I would reassess after two, unless we hit scum. If we did hit scum, I'm on auto-pilot the rest of the game. That's how sure I am of my town reads.

Good luck finding 2 unanimously town read pairs.

You lack confidence in your reads, I do not. I firmly believe scum is in those four names. Make use of the DP; I'm a busy man. Just don't expect me to help much (even though I say this and I'm sure I'll poke in instead of doing what I should be.....). I am simply noting my preference to rush. Not like it matters, since we'll have to get a majority of players to agree, and three seem to be elsewhere, so it's not likely going to end quickly any time soon.

Its not likely at all. In the contrary I lime this game because it is long winded like a mafia scum game. We have more time to think and make accurate non rushed decisions.

As far as the drama goes, I don't believe you yet. And, the fact you were drunk is a separate, personal issue. It's not a judgment of you in the least, but I got a personal issue with drinking (thanks to my father). I don't close at restaurants anymore because I can't stand the drunks. Not drama, just stating a fact and how it affects the game (i.e. my read).

Chaos to be frank I don't care about your personal issues with drinking. You took something small and made it big and I'm convinced that you are craving drama and attention. Its rather childish. I've told you multiple times I am not angry with you. Anyone rational who read the message would probably agree that you are exaggerating this. This drama you are creating is distracting from the game, and is going nowhere despite multiple times I've tried to mediate it with you. I wasn't mad before but your constant accusations that I am mad at you are starting to make me actually mad at you. Grow up dude seriously. I am trying to respond to you civilly but you won't drop this sh1t and its absurd.

Nothing more than that. Do you want me to say that I scum read you and push for your lynch, even though my objectivity may be compromised?

If you did that then your judgment and alignment is compromised. No townie would scum read someone over a personal feud, especially one that he made up in his mind.
TUF
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6/4/2017 11:20:49 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Dead Players

Forever- Bonnie- Mafia (Lynched DP1)
Chaos- Clyde- Town (Lovers angst DP1)
Cosmojarvis- Paul Bernardo- Town (Lynched DP2)
Subutai- Karla Holmoka- Town (Lovers angst DP2)

Living Players

SuiGeneris- David Parker Ray (claim may be unst"s)
Chaos2 (esocial)
Warren- Viktor Sayenko
Subutai2 (Zarroette)
LikeMagic- Cricket Balasz
Danielle
VelCrow
TUF -Leonard Lake
Skep
Unstobbaple- Glenda Jean Ray

Known pairs:

TUF/LikeMagic
Dani/Velcrow
Skep/Zaro (Poe)
Khaos(2)/Warren
Sui/Unstop

This list will be updated in my sig. I removed the links to each claim, as it was getting a little complicated to keep up with, and I think it is unnecessary.
TUF
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6/4/2017 11:27:41 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/4/2017 6:21:23 PM, LikeMagic wrote:
At 6/4/2017 1:53:18 PM, warren42 wrote:
The dumbtelling got out of hand, and the sudden ability to comprehend and articulate struck me as scummy. Oh well.

What do you think of TUF's play in relation to me last DP. He was making all of these arguments to try and undermine my reads on him, suggesting I was fabricating and engaging in WIFOM, but refused to scum read me and is not advocating my lynch. This seems strange to me and likely scum motivated.

Engaging in an argument about your behavior is doesn't mean I scum read you. I had questions about some of your motives, but you answered them rather well. I am not so stubborn as to pursue beating a dead horse if I feel the answer has mostly been satisfied. You actually stuck around and answered the questions as well, and your behavior didn't seem scummy; For example, reacting emotionally, or omgus'ing me for simply calling you out, or even seeming overly defensive. Those things are typically scum tells to me. Ultimately I dropped it because I tend to tunnel vision sometimes, and I though I dis-agree with your way of scum telling, I find it a little more authentic based on your answers.
TUF
Posts: 23,816
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6/4/2017 11:29:29 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/4/2017 8:01:33 PM, Sui_Generis wrote:
"avoided"

And Cosmo was quite obviously town. what a dumb lynch.

It's a good thing we had so much of your input near the end there to try and deter the lynch then- Oh wait...
TUF
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6/4/2017 11:33:18 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/4/2017 6:09:44 PM, LikeMagic wrote:
I really think TUF is likely scum and think he should be the lynch. He's not only misrepresenting and exaggerating facts, but it's very strange that he is making all of these arguments against me and is suggesting I am scummy but is unwilling to actually scum read me or lynch me for it. He has stated that I contrived a read on him, that I falsified an analysis, that I flip-flopped on him with no grounds to do so, and that my early scum read on him was WIFOM. If he believes these things there is no reason for him not to scum read me and be pushing my lynch if he's town. It's very odd.

VTL TUF

I dis-agree that there is no reason to be reserved as town. And you seem to be ignoring the fact that I was never directly calling you scum during our exchange yesterday. I wanted to understand you and your actions, and I felt our exchange satisfied that. I am still not sold on your affiliation, but you are definitely not a priority at the moment. I think Skeps, sui, and unst need to make a considerable effort this day phase or risk being lynched.

VTL unstoppable.
LikeMagic
Posts: 2,190
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6/5/2017 12:05:03 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/4/2017 11:33:18 PM, TUF wrote:
At 6/4/2017 6:09:44 PM, LikeMagic wrote:
I really think TUF is likely scum and think he should be the lynch. He's not only misrepresenting and exaggerating facts, but it's very strange that he is making all of these arguments against me and is suggesting I am scummy but is unwilling to actually scum read me or lynch me for it. He has stated that I contrived a read on him, that I falsified an analysis, that I flip-flopped on him with no grounds to do so, and that my early scum read on him was WIFOM. If he believes these things there is no reason for him not to scum read me and be pushing my lynch if he's town. It's very odd.

VTL TUF

I dis-agree that there is no reason to be reserved as town. And you seem to be ignoring the fact that I was never directly calling you scum during our exchange yesterday. I wanted to understand you and your actions, and I felt our exchange satisfied that. I am still not sold on your affiliation, but you are definitely not a priority at the moment. I think Skeps, sui, and unst need to make a considerable effort this day phase or risk being lynched.

VTL unstoppable.

Nothing in your last post to me last DP in any way suggested that you felt my answers were acceptable or satisfactory or that you think my actions were in any way town. You indicated the following in your last post to me:

1. I flip-flopped a lot on my reads of you without justification. (Inaccurate and an exaggeration but you seem to believe it)
2. My read on you is contrived (*eye roll*)
3. I was willing to lynch you over a weak read (again false, but you keep stating it so you must believe it
4. My willingness to lynch you and die is WIFOM
5. My representation of your town behavior in Rick and Morty is innacurate
6. I changed my read to slight town because I didn't want to be lynched as scum

If you believe even half of these things, which you never posted anything suggesting you don't or my answers somehow changed your perspective on them, then you should be scum reading me. The fact that you aren't and the fact that you wanted to just randomly drop the topic suggests to me that you don't really believe any of these things, but were raising those arguments solely to undermine my scum reading you, without getting me lynched. I cannot think of one town motive for it. Also since these initial reads cosmo has flipped town and I am one of the first people to push for his lynch so again, it's incredibly odd that you aren't scum reading me based on your reasoning, and aren't advocating my lynch. Even Danielle whose perspective and reads you've expressed great respect for, is scum reading me, but you aren't even with all your analysis on how fabricated my reads are relating to you. Just super odd.
LikeMagic
Posts: 2,190
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6/5/2017 12:07:56 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/4/2017 8:01:33 PM, Sui_Generis wrote:
"avoided"

And Cosmo was quite obviously town. what a dumb lynch.

Thoughts on the TUF situation?
TUF
Posts: 23,816
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6/5/2017 12:15:35 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
Updated thoughts/reads

I am doing this because there are a few players I can't recall their behavior, so will be re-focusing on posts from players I skimmed or didn't look much into prior to this phase.

Sui Generis- Day phase 1 he starts out with mostly theory analysis on game mechanics, questioning a utility of a mass claim, and theorizing if mafia have a pm or not. in post 122 of DP1, he continues arguing statistics and engages in his large unnessecary battle with chaos. Sui was a high poster in DP1, but after reviewing his posts, I really don't find a lot of reads (if any) that shows me he is actively scum hunting. All he did really was add a vote to forever then continue talking about game mechanics or making random unhelpful game comments here and there. I think people excuse his activity as contribution. I see him as skating by.

Khaos2- I am trying to be open minded with khaos, as I always have with him. I know he tends to think differently than most players (not neccesarily that he is wrong) but he does sometimes get tunnel vision over really small details (the cosmo "slip" argument for example). He also tries somewhat crazy things (like trying to catch forever in a slip which could have backfired). He has always done these types of things in games I've played with him, he is the gambit man. That said, I am getting a bad feeling from him. He was more conservative DP1 on forever and even kind of made an argument for her being town. Even later when he said he was 80% sure she was scum, he was not willing to lynch her that phase until forever was closer to a lynch with votes from others. His aggressive play in DP2 against cosmo, and his eagerness to rush the game in DP3 is sketching me out, simply because his behavior is different than it was when he was playing more conservatively as town. I think it will be good to look at him closer in later day phases, after skeps, unst, and sui have made adequate attempts to play.

Warren- I am slightly intimidated by warren, because I think he is a pretty good player. I never really know quite how to read him in the few games I've seen him in. He is generally a logical poster. I can get on board with the argument chaos made earlier that he thinks he is town because the way warren entered the game willing to lynch himself to nab his partner, not being fully caught up. I don't buy every WIFOM "offer to lynch myself to kill my partner, so people think I am innocent" claim, but I will cede chaos that this was more authentic than others. Warren has been relatively active and helpful. He is not a priority this phase. Null/slight town

Subutai2- Still waiting for posts. Analyzing his behavior this phase should be a priority.

LikeMagic- I explained my thoughts on her earlier. Ultimately I am unsure where to go with her. I've engaged with her a few times, and I think I dis-agree with a lot of her logic in this game. I do think she is a smart player, but I think she is overly skeptical of veteran players like myself and Dani. I can understand this, but this phase I don't think we need to focus on lynching people whom we have weak reads on. Most of the reads she has had on me feel weak, yet she is pushing another one on me this phase, when there are at least 4 people who need to make an active effort this phase. Her tunnel vision makes me wary of her. Again, not a priority this phase, but if this goes late game, I would be more skeptical of her than others.

Danielle- My previous town read on her stands. She has been inactive the last few day's which I find hypocritical since she hounded me for my 2 day period of inactivity, but I have no doubt she will return and post when she has availability, as she did in overwatch mafia.

VelCrow- Horrible speller, can't capitilize. He is passionate and seems to like controversy. I have never played with this player, but he mentioned he is from EpicMafia. Having played there several times, I recognize the qualities and tactics often used on that website. While I don't find him overly helpful, he does seem town to me.

Skep- The only notable posts I remembered from skeps on DP1 were from page 5 where he jumped on chaos's mentioning of forever's slip. Later makes a comment about how it would be hilarious if chaos scum slipped instead, but otherwise was absent most of DP1. I don't recall much activity DP2 either. Skeps I am always weary about seeing as he seems to fly under the radar for making posts here and there. This can be quite dangerous as scum. He is a priority this phase as well.

Unstobbaple- Dp1 starts out voting LM for agreeing to a massclaim. Then dis-appears for the rest of the game. He is a definite priority.
TUF
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6/5/2017 12:32:58 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/5/2017 12:05:03 AM, LikeMagic wrote:
At 6/4/2017 11:33:18 PM, TUF wrote:
At 6/4/2017 6:09:44 PM, LikeMagic wrote:
I really think TUF is likely scum and think he should be the lynch. He's not only misrepresenting and exaggerating facts, but it's very strange that he is making all of these arguments against me and is suggesting I am scummy but is unwilling to actually scum read me or lynch me for it. He has stated that I contrived a read on him, that I falsified an analysis, that I flip-flopped on him with no grounds to do so, and that my early scum read on him was WIFOM. If he believes these things there is no reason for him not to scum read me and be pushing my lynch if he's town. It's very odd.

VTL TUF

I dis-agree that there is no reason to be reserved as town. And you seem to be ignoring the fact that I was never directly calling you scum during our exchange yesterday. I wanted to understand you and your actions, and I felt our exchange satisfied that. I am still not sold on your affiliation, but you are definitely not a priority at the moment. I think Skeps, sui, and unst need to make a considerable effort this day phase or risk being lynched.

VTL unstoppable.


Nothing in your last post to me last DP in any way suggested that you felt my answers were acceptable or satisfactory or that you think my actions were in any way town. You indicated the following in your last post to me:

I recommend you re-read it then and try to be more open minded.

1. I flip-flopped a lot on my reads of you without justification. (Inaccurate and an exaggeration but you seem to believe it)

This is something you demonstrated yourself to me by showing how you changed your reads 6 times. The odd thing to me was that you changed your reads this much over one arguably weak read to begin with, not that your reads changed. You've since explained, and I accept the answer.

2. My read on you is contrived (*eye roll*)

Oh brother. The eye roll is really a childish way to dismiss the reasoning stated behind the point. And i've since stated that I may be tunnel vision on this read. The read doesn't make logical sense to me, but you answered for the read and you seem to be passionate about association as a scum tell.

3. I was willing to lynch you over a weak read (again false, but you keep stating it so you must believe it)

I still think it is a weak read, but am willing to dismiss this as a difference of opinion. We won't go anywhere with this.

4. My willingness to lynch you and die is WIFOM

Could be. Is that why all of a sudden you are focusing me this phase? Couldn't be that you are desperately trying to prove me wrong? lol

5. My representation of your town behavior in Rick and Morty is innacurate

It is.

6. I changed my read to slight town because I didn't want to be lynched as scum

Uh what?

If you believe even half of these things, which you never posted anything suggesting you don't or my answers somehow changed your perspective on them, then you should be scum reading me. The fact that you aren't and the fact that you wanted to just randomly drop the topic suggests to me that you don't really believe any of these things, but were raising those arguments solely to undermine my scum reading you, without getting me lynched. I cannot think of one town motive for it.

I don't see a point in continuing to argue these things with you ad nauseum. This is a mafia game, not a debate. My sole intention isn't to prove you wrong, it's to find scum. Your problem here is focus. You are hung up on the debate still and are unwilling to let it go. There is plenty of town reason to back down from someone you previously "pressured" (if you want to call it that). As scum, why not just save face and be consistent and try to continue to making you look bad? If anything to create distance. The fact that I backed off you should be way more of a town tell than not.

Also since these initial reads cosmo has flipped town and I am one of the first people to push for his lynch so again, it's incredibly odd that you aren't scum reading me based on your reasoning, and aren't advocating my lynch.

I am not understanding your point with cosmo and it's relevancy to this discussion. I may just be tired.

Even Danielle whose perspective and reads you've expressed great respect for, is scum reading me, but you aren't even with all your analysis on how fabricated my reads are relating to you. Just super odd.

I haven't fully read your exchange with dani. Anyways having respect for dani doesn't mean I bandwagon all her reads. I have the same respect warren, and even you, who I find to be good players.
TUF
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6/5/2017 12:35:15 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/5/2017 12:07:56 AM, LikeMagic wrote:
At 6/4/2017 8:01:33 PM, Sui_Generis wrote:
"avoided"

And Cosmo was quite obviously town. what a dumb lynch.

Thoughts on the TUF situation?

While I encourage you pushing sui for activity, I find it a bit slimy that you are seemingly trying to get people to bandwagon on your ideas. Especially when there are inactives that should be focused first. Let him read the day phase and post his own thoughts naturally, this is just minipulative and a low blow. You seem to be salty that I dared argue with you.
Sui_Generis
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6/5/2017 12:36:25 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
I think the most pro-town action is to try to replace Unstobbaple. If he starts posting, then make a decision. For various reasons my motivation in this game is waning. So I'm down to lynch Unstob if there's a significant belief he's scum -- NOT because I'm scumread, as I'm not scum.

I'll spew out whatever answers you require of me if you don't want to go with what I've said, and if doing so will stave off mislynching me.
"How true it is that words are but vague shadows of the volumes we mean. Little audible links they are, chaining together great inaudible feelings and purposes."

"Nobody wants to be in your sig." ~Emilrose
LikeMagic
Posts: 2,190
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6/5/2017 12:50:15 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/5/2017 12:32:58 AM, TUF wrote:
At 6/5/2017 12:05:03 AM, LikeMagic wrote:
At 6/4/2017 11:33:18 PM, TUF wrote:
At 6/4/2017 6:09:44 PM, LikeMagic wrote:
I really think TUF is likely scum and think he should be the lynch. He's not only misrepresenting and exaggerating facts, but it's very strange that he is making all of these arguments against me and is suggesting I am scummy but is unwilling to actually scum read me or lynch me for it. He has stated that I contrived a read on him, that I falsified an analysis, that I flip-flopped on him with no grounds to do so, and that my early scum read on him was WIFOM. If he believes these things there is no reason for him not to scum read me and be pushing my lynch if he's town. It's very odd.

VTL TUF

I dis-agree that there is no reason to be reserved as town. And you seem to be ignoring the fact that I was never directly calling you scum during our exchange yesterday. I wanted to understand you and your actions, and I felt our exchange satisfied that. I am still not sold on your affiliation, but you are definitely not a priority at the moment. I think Skeps, sui, and unst need to make a considerable effort this day phase or risk being lynched.

VTL unstoppable.


Nothing in your last post to me last DP in any way suggested that you felt my answers were acceptable or satisfactory or that you think my actions were in any way town. You indicated the following in your last post to me:

I recommend you re-read it then and try to be more open minded.

1. I flip-flopped a lot on my reads of you without justification. (Inaccurate and an exaggeration but you seem to believe it)

This is something you demonstrated yourself to me by showing how you changed your reads 6 times. The odd thing to me was that you changed your reads this much over one arguably weak read to begin with, not that your reads changed. You've since explained, and I accept the answer.

2. My read on you is contrived (*eye roll*)

Oh brother. The eye roll is really a childish way to dismiss the reasoning stated behind the point. And i've since stated that I may be tunnel vision on this read. The read doesn't make logical sense to me, but you answered for the read and you seem to be passionate about association as a scum tell.

3. I was willing to lynch you over a weak read (again false, but you keep stating it so you must believe it)

I still think it is a weak read, but am willing to dismiss this as a difference of opinion. We won't go anywhere with this.

4. My willingness to lynch you and die is WIFOM

Could be. Is that why all of a sudden you are focusing me this phase? Couldn't be that you are desperately trying to prove me wrong? lol

5. My representation of your town behavior in Rick and Morty is innacurate

It is.

6. I changed my read to slight town because I didn't want to be lynched as scum

Uh what?

Right so, the point to my post was that if you believed all of the six points you made in your last post DP2 or even half of them it doesn't make sense that you aren't scum reading me and do not think I should be lynched. In fact you came into this DP ignoring it, and not even addressing it. It's all odd and I can only think of a scum motive for it.

So again, to be clear I scum read you and think you should be lynched because you spent a whole lot of character space last DP arguing that I am fabricating reads and my behavior in relation to you does not make sense. Yet never scum read me for it or suggested me as a lynch candidate.
LikeMagic
Posts: 2,190
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6/5/2017 12:51:15 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/5/2017 12:35:15 AM, TUF wrote:
At 6/5/2017 12:07:56 AM, LikeMagic wrote:
At 6/4/2017 8:01:33 PM, Sui_Generis wrote:
"avoided"

And Cosmo was quite obviously town. what a dumb lynch.

Thoughts on the TUF situation?

While I encourage you pushing sui for activity, I find it a bit slimy that you are seemingly trying to get people to bandwagon on your ideas. Especially when there are inactives that should be focused first. Let him read the day phase and post his own thoughts naturally, this is just minipulative and a low blow. You seem to be salty that I dared argue with you.

seriously? everyone asks other players for thoughts on unfolding events. It's happened multiple times this game and has happened in every game I have played.
TUF
Posts: 23,816
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6/5/2017 1:00:14 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 6/5/2017 12:50:15 AM, LikeMagic wrote:

Right so, the point to my post was that if you believed all of the six points you made in your last post DP2 or even half of them it doesn't make sense that you aren't scum reading me and do not think I should be lynched. In fact you came into this DP ignoring it, and not even addressing it. It's all odd and I can only think of a scum motive for it.

I did not ignore it. I've said there are bigger fish to fry, and even last DP in my last post to you I acknowledged several times I was going to be backing down. Debate =/= scum reading you. You are caught up in the arguments. Also outline the scum motive for dropping my read in detail, I am genuinely curious. You haven't substantied this.

So again, to be clear I scum read you and think you should be lynched because you spent a whole lot of character space last DP arguing that I am fabricating reads and my behavior in relation to you does not make sense. Yet never scum read me for it or suggested me as a lynch candidate.

I spend a lot of character space responding to other people as well. Also I didn't say you were a lynch candidate, just that I scum read you. Also how are you going to get on me for using too many characters when that same day phase you were stating my activity was a scum tell? This is so contradictory. Here is the part where you mistake me saying you are contradicting yourself as me accusing you of being scum.