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Clue Mafia - Day Phase 5 / END GAME

Danielle
Posts: 26,599
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8/10/2017 6:39:47 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
The mafia killed the Hydra in the hypothetical night phase 4.

Winners: MAFIA!

I don't think there's an MVP in this game.

Living Players

01 TUF (recruited to the Mafia on NP3)
02 Wylted (Forever)

TUF: You are a 2-shot Deputy Sheriff. On any 2 night phases of your choice, you may choose to investigate someone's guilt or innocence. If you do so, you have a 50/50 chance of killing them... RECRUITED TO THE MAFIA on Night Phase 3

Wylted (Forever): You are a Vanilla townie. You have no official abilities. You win with the town.

Dead Players

Wylted 1: 3x Justice - Town
Udel: 2x Hunter - Mafia
Anoid/bsh1: Jailkeeper - Town
SeventhProfessor: Vanilla - Town
Chaos88: 2x Politician - Town
warren: Yakuza - Mafia
Sui_Generis: 3x Tracker - Town

bsh1 (Lucky): You are a Vanilla townie. You have no official abilities. You win with the town.

Hydra: You are a compulsive Inventor. You have created versions of the following:

(a) counterfeit pardon
(b) a 3D printed gun
(c) night-vision binoculars
(d) high grade cocaine
(e) security camera
(f) bulletproof vest

There are a total of 6 objects. Each night, you MUST visit someone and give them one of your inventions. Please read carefully.

* The pardon protects its owner from being lynched the following day phase.

* The 3D printed gun forces its owner to carry out a night kill the following night phase.

* The binoculars give its owner watcher powers for that night phase.

* The high grade cocaine enhances one's role or general abilities in some unknown way.

* The security camera allows its owner to see all players that visit them during that night phase.

* The bulletproof vest protects someone from a night kill that night phase.

You win with the town.
Danielle
Posts: 26,599
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8/10/2017 6:40:09 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Day Phase 1

Clue 01 -- The OP stated the day phase would expire at the random time of 9:02 AM

Clue 02 -- A picture of vanilla beans

Clue 2.5 -- I posted my first official picture clue at 9:02 AM (EST) and wrote "clues" implying there were more than one clue contained in that post

DP1 clues were primarily about set-up. 9:2 is the number of town to scum. Acknowledging three vanillas hinted to mafia that they could CC a vanilla claim to compel a mislynch (useful information for a Hunter / Yakuza) if they wanted to.

Day/Night Phase 2

Clue 03 -- I posted a picture of a Disney villain that's an evil poacher (hunter). If you Google "evil hunter" this picture comes up.

Clue 04 -- I posted a clip of The Sopranos where one of the mafia goons is dressed in hunting gear.

DP2 clues were all pertaining to the existence of a mafia hunter. Considering Udel was tracked visiting 2 people, players could have looked up the hunter role and figured out the clues (evil / pertaining to mafia) meant the hunter was scum. It could have explained why Udel was seen visiting two people.

During the NP, I gave the mafia a potential fake claim (Innocent Child).

Clue 05 -- I also said the next day phase would start at 10:10, noting the new ratio of town to scum was 10:1.

Day Phase 3

Clue 06 -- I said "One by one the clues get overlooked. Including this one, there have been at least 6 clues in the game (day phase) so far to give context."

This notes there have been at least 6 clues for people to look for, and emphasizes the number ONE which I needlessly said three times, as player #1 (warren) was scum.

Clue 07 -- I posted a picture of a woman with very obvious YAKUZA tattoos hinting the existence of a Yakuza

Day Phase 4

Clue 08 -- I pointed out the 5:55 time stamp not meaning anything.

I had a 9th clue ready that I was about to post, but the day phase ended before I could.
TUF
Posts: 23,816
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8/10/2017 6:42:28 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
GG guys. TBH even though the odds favored mafia when I was recruited, I was still dis-appointed. Was having more fun as town lol.
Chaos88
Posts: 4,097
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8/10/2017 6:45:22 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
I would have lynched TUF. Too risky to keep him alive, and I don't think wifom would apply.

Just should have lynched Warren........
warren42
Posts: 4,456
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8/10/2017 6:45:50 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/10/2017 6:45:22 PM, Chaos88 wrote:
I would have lynched TUF. Too risky to keep him alive, and I don't think wifom would apply.

Just should have lynched Warren........

;)
TUF
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8/10/2017 6:45:56 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/10/2017 6:44:33 PM, warren42 wrote:
GG all

WP warren. I would have bought the innocent child claim all the way til DP5. I am impressed. Apparently LM thinks she would have lynched you, but I don't think enough people would be on board with it. I guess I can see doubt about the dp5 claim just because of how few players are in the game.
LikeMagic
Posts: 2,190
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8/10/2017 6:47:01 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
This game was BS and the recruitment role was 100% bastard. Not only was it just generally bastard for it to be permitted so late in the game, but scum should not have been able to kill sui. Danielle said that the night actions resolve as follows

"mafia role >> mafia NK >> townie roles"

which means warren should have suicide before the NK, meaning the NK could not go through
TUF
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8/10/2017 6:47:59 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/10/2017 6:45:22 PM, Chaos88 wrote:
I would have lynched TUF. Too risky to keep him alive, and I don't think wifom would apply.

Just should have lynched Warren........

Damn you were aggressive mate. I town read you hard until you started threatening people with your role, and kept pushing me to use my role openly in the day phase... I don't understand dude... I just can't.... You didn't have to die DP2.
Danielle
Posts: 26,599
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8/10/2017 6:48:06 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
@Magic - There's nothing bastard about the existence of a Yakuza role.

It's a legitimate role. I did not make it up. I use it in the majority of my games (which FourTrouble acknowledged) AND I gave a clue about it. The Yakuza role was used exactly the way it was intended, and balanced the ratio of town to scum perfectly IMO. Whining about its existence because scum used this legitimate role wisely is kind of silly. Please don't.

All the non-vanilla roles could have been explicitly useful to scum with the exception of Tracker (but they could have recruited the Tracker to manipulate town or avoid getting caught). The vanillas were "confirmed" via the clue, so the mafia could have cc'd one to compel a mislynch or recruit a "confirmed" player. The Jailkeeper could have worked as a role blocker; the Inventor had things that could help scum; the Politician could help scum; the Deputy Sheriff could have helped scum; etc. Also, while TUF's role and the Inventor gun COULD have caused an extra kill, night actions could have been coordinated using the bulletproof vest to test claims. Also the Inventor did not have to use the gun. That was something that could have helped scum if recruited.

I'm going to lunch now. BBL!
LikeMagic
Posts: 2,190
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8/10/2017 6:48:56 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/10/2017 6:45:56 PM, TUF wrote:
At 8/10/2017 6:44:33 PM, warren42 wrote:
GG all

WP warren. I would have bought the innocent child claim all the way til DP5. I am impressed. Apparently LM thinks she would have lynched you, but I don't think enough people would be on board with it. I guess I can see doubt about the dp5 claim just because of how few players are in the game.

I'd have voted him next for sure. I called BS on his claim right away. But it's hardly well played by warren. The game was rigged in scum favor.
Wylted
Posts: 25,970
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8/10/2017 6:49:04 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Wish my head was on straight prior. My gut told me Khaos was town and I was stating dishonest reads about FT because I was trying to move him away from the null pile. He was in my town pile after his claim though.
Danielle
Posts: 26,599
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8/10/2017 6:49:39 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/10/2017 6:42:28 PM, TUF wrote:
GG guys. TBH even though the odds favored mafia when I was recruited, I was still dis-appointed. Was having more fun as town lol.

The game started with 9 town and 2 scum. There were several town power roles and I "confirmed" the vanillas while giving clues about other roles and the set up ratio. This was definitely my least scum sided game, and it went right down to the wire as many of my games do.
warren42
Posts: 4,456
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8/10/2017 6:50:53 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/10/2017 6:47:01 PM, LikeMagic wrote:
This game was BS and the recruitment role was 100% bastard. Not only was it just generally bastard for it to be permitted so late in the game, but scum should not have been able to kill sui. Danielle said that the night actions resolve as follows

"mafia role >> mafia NK >> townie roles"

which means warren should have suicide before the NK, meaning the NK could not go through

I commuted suicide to recruit TUF. He did the NK.
TUF
Posts: 23,816
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8/10/2017 6:51:55 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/10/2017 6:48:06 PM, Danielle wrote:
@Magic - There's nothing bastard about the existence of a Yakuza role.

It's a legitimate role. I did not make it up. I use it in the majority of my games (which FourTrouble acknowledged) AND I gave a clue about it. The Yakuza role was used exactly the way it was intended, and balanced the ratio of town to scum perfectly IMO. Whining about its existence because scum used this legitimate role wisely is kind of silly. Please don't.

All the non-vanilla roles could have been explicitly useful to scum with the exception of Tracker (but they could have recruited the Tracker to manipulate town or avoid getting caught). The vanillas were "confirmed" via the clue, so the mafia could have cc'd one to compel a mislynch or recruit a "confirmed" player. The Jailkeeper could have worked as a role blocker; the Inventor had things that could help scum; the Politician could help scum; the Deputy Sheriff could have helped scum; etc. Also, while TUF's role and the Inventor gun COULD have caused an extra kill, night actions could have been coordinated using the bulletproof vest to test claims. Also the Inventor did not have to use the gun. That was something that could have helped scum if recruited.

I'm going to lunch now. BBL!

I am going to agree with Danielle. Warren was risky by holding on to his yakuza role, in all likelihood, most people would have used it earlier. Warrent wasn't ever really majorly scum read by more than a couple people though so he could afford to wait. I don't think this is the Mod's fault that the game was a bit swingy. I think yakuza's can make things difficult, but I totally don't think the last DP had to be a gamble the way you and FT thought it did. If I was town, I would have tried to analyze behavior at least to some extent.
LikeMagic
Posts: 2,190
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8/10/2017 6:52:02 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/10/2017 6:48:06 PM, Danielle wrote:
@Magic - There's nothing bastard about the existence of a Yakuza role.

It's a legitimate role. I did not make it up. I use it in the majority of my games (which FourTrouble acknowledged) AND I gave a clue about it. The Yakuza role was used exactly the way it was intended, and balanced the ratio of town to scum perfectly IMO. Whining about its existence because scum used this legitimate role wisely is kind of silly. Please don't.

All the non-vanilla roles could have been explicitly useful to scum with the exception of Tracker (but they could have recruited the Tracker to manipulate town or avoid getting caught). The vanillas were "confirmed" via the clue, so the mafia could have cc'd one to compel a mislynch or recruit a "confirmed" player. The Jailkeeper could have worked as a role blocker; the Inventor had things that could help scum; the Politician could help scum; the Deputy Sheriff could have helped scum; etc. Also, while TUF's role and the Inventor gun COULD have caused an extra kill, night actions could have been coordinated using the bulletproof vest to test claims. Also the Inventor did not have to use the gun. That was something that could have helped scum if recruited.

I'm going to lunch now. BBL!

whatever you have to tell yourself to feel good about your game. The reality is you knew it wasn't balanced which is why you said not to complain about it in the OP.

but even if the role was legit, which just because something exists doesn't make it legitimate, the way it effectuated was not. If it's true that mafia roles were supposed to occur before the NK, then there shouldn't have been a NK last night.
FourTrouble
Posts: 16,245
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8/10/2017 6:53:07 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
The game was completely a gamble , lol

There's literally no way to figure out who is recruited.
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TUF
Posts: 23,816
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8/10/2017 6:53:21 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/10/2017 6:49:39 PM, Danielle wrote:
At 8/10/2017 6:42:28 PM, TUF wrote:
GG guys. TBH even though the odds favored mafia when I was recruited, I was still dis-appointed. Was having more fun as town lol.

The game started with 9 town and 2 scum. There were several town power roles and I "confirmed" the vanillas while giving clues about other roles and the set up ratio. This was definitely my least scum sided game, and it went right down to the wire as many of my games do.

Which is why I would have wanted to be town. Games down to the wire are way more fun to solve and crack as town.
LikeMagic
Posts: 2,190
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8/10/2017 6:53:26 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/10/2017 6:50:53 PM, warren42 wrote:
At 8/10/2017 6:47:01 PM, LikeMagic wrote:
This game was BS and the recruitment role was 100% bastard. Not only was it just generally bastard for it to be permitted so late in the game, but scum should not have been able to kill sui. Danielle said that the night actions resolve as follows

"mafia role >> mafia NK >> townie roles"

which means warren should have suicide before the NK, meaning the NK could not go through

I commuted suicide to recruit TUF. He did the NK.

So not only did you recruit him, but it all went through before the end of the NP? That's even more BS. This game is even more illegitimate than I thought. I def probably won't be participating in danielle's games going forward.
TUF
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8/10/2017 6:54:12 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/10/2017 6:53:07 PM, FourTrouble wrote:
The game was completely a gamble , lol

There's literally no way to figure out who is recruited.

You could use behavior analysis. I can't recall a game where you haven't complained about balance in the endgame, other than maybe wylted's.
FourTrouble
Posts: 16,245
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8/10/2017 6:54:37 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/10/2017 6:53:26 PM, LikeMagic wrote:
At 8/10/2017 6:50:53 PM, warren42 wrote:
At 8/10/2017 6:47:01 PM, LikeMagic wrote:
This game was BS and the recruitment role was 100% bastard. Not only was it just generally bastard for it to be permitted so late in the game, but scum should not have been able to kill sui. Danielle said that the night actions resolve as follows

"mafia role >> mafia NK >> townie roles"

which means warren should have suicide before the NK, meaning the NK could not go through

I commuted suicide to recruit TUF. He did the NK.

So not only did you recruit him, but it all went through before the end of the NP? That's even more BS. This game is even more illegitimate than I thought. I def probably won't be participating in danielle's games going forward.

lol
If you'd like a vote on your debate, please send me a link. I'll do my best to offer a sufficient RFD in your favor.

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Danielle
Posts: 26,599
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8/10/2017 6:55:30 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/10/2017 6:47:01 PM, LikeMagic wrote:
This game was BS and the recruitment role was 100% bastard. Not only was it just generally bastard for it to be permitted so late in the game, but scum should not have been able to kill sui. Danielle said that the night actions resolve as follows

This is a legitimate mafia role and your ignorance of its existence doesn't change that.

"mafia role >> mafia NK >> townie roles"

which means warren should have suicide before the NK, meaning the NK could not go through

I know that and I told them that via the PM. TUF carried out the night kill.

He was recruited before using his role (which he attempted to use on you and failed... had it gone through, he would have been obvious scum for targeting you and scum would have lost).
TUF
Posts: 23,816
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8/10/2017 6:55:31 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/10/2017 6:53:26 PM, LikeMagic wrote:
At 8/10/2017 6:50:53 PM, warren42 wrote:
At 8/10/2017 6:47:01 PM, LikeMagic wrote:
This game was BS and the recruitment role was 100% bastard. Not only was it just generally bastard for it to be permitted so late in the game, but scum should not have been able to kill sui. Danielle said that the night actions resolve as follows

"mafia role >> mafia NK >> townie roles"

which means warren should have suicide before the NK, meaning the NK could not go through

I commuted suicide to recruit TUF. He did the NK.

So not only did you recruit him, but it all went through before the end of the NP? That's even more BS. This game is even more illegitimate than I thought. I def probably won't be participating in danielle's games going forward.

That's how yakuza roles work, Danielle didn't make that mechanic up. Warren should be getting credit for holding onto it for so long, rather than Danielle getting flack for this role.
Wylted
Posts: 25,970
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8/10/2017 6:56:07 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/10/2017 6:54:12 PM, TUF wrote:
At 8/10/2017 6:53:07 PM, FourTrouble wrote:
The game was completely a gamble , lol

There's literally no way to figure out who is recruited.

You could use behavior analysis. I can't recall a game where you haven't complained about balance in the endgame, other than maybe wylted's.

I leaned on his expertise to create balance, so it was not unbiased of him toss at it was fair there..

He seems to always think the games are scum sided.
LikeMagic
Posts: 2,190
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8/10/2017 6:56:19 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/10/2017 6:54:12 PM, TUF wrote:
At 8/10/2017 6:53:07 PM, FourTrouble wrote:
The game was completely a gamble , lol

There's literally no way to figure out who is recruited.

You could use behavior analysis. I can't recall a game where you haven't complained about balance in the endgame, other than maybe wylted's.

what behavioral analysis exactly? One DP worth of behavioral analysis in a game with built reads? It's like DP1 where town is almost always lynched. But it'd DP1 with MYLO. smh.
FourTrouble
Posts: 16,245
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8/10/2017 6:56:19 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/10/2017 6:54:12 PM, TUF wrote:
At 8/10/2017 6:53:07 PM, FourTrouble wrote:
The game was completely a gamble , lol

There's literally no way to figure out who is recruited.

You could use behavior analysis. I can't recall a game where you haven't complained about balance in the endgame, other than maybe wylted's.

balance isn't the issue - the recruiting mechanic is what bugs me (and anyone who puts effort into the game only to see it mean nothing).
If you'd like a vote on your debate, please send me a link. I'll do my best to offer a sufficient RFD in your favor.

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FourTrouble
Posts: 16,245
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8/10/2017 6:57:22 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/10/2017 6:56:19 PM, LikeMagic wrote:
At 8/10/2017 6:54:12 PM, TUF wrote:
At 8/10/2017 6:53:07 PM, FourTrouble wrote:
The game was completely a gamble , lol

There's literally no way to figure out who is recruited.

You could use behavior analysis. I can't recall a game where you haven't complained about balance in the endgame, other than maybe wylted's.

what behavioral analysis exactly? One DP worth of behavioral analysis in a game with built reads? It's like DP1 where town is almost always lynched. But it'd DP1 with MYLO. smh.

No, there's no way to use behavioral analysis when TUF already has an uninformed perspective. He's effectively town in all respects. Townies, at MYLO, have to worry about survival just as much as scum. It's bs.
If you'd like a vote on your debate, please send me a link. I'll do my best to offer a sufficient RFD in your favor.

Also: If you'd like to vote bomb a debate and need help crafting a sufficient RFD, let me know.