Who would win the presidential election between Donald Trump and Bernie Sanders?

Posted by: NewLifeChristian

Bernie's hair might make him lose. :-D

Poll closed on 9/15/2015 at 12:00AM.
41 Total Votes

Bernie Sanders

Bernard "Bernie" Sanders is an American politician and the junior United States Senator from Vermont. Before serving in the Senate, he represented Vermont's at-large congressional district in the United States House of Representatives and served as ... mayor of Burlington, the largest city in Vermont. Sanders is a self-described democratic socialist, and has praised Scandinavian-style social democracy.Sanders runs for office as an independent but caucuses with the Democratic Party and is counted as a Democrat for purposes of committee assignments. He was the only independent member of the House during most of his service and is the longest-serving independent in U.S. Congressional history.In an interview with The Nation on March 6, 2014, Sanders stated that he is "prepared to run for President of the United States" in 2016   more
24 votes

Donald Trump

Donald John Trump, Sr. Is an American businessman, investor, television personality and author. He is the chairman and president of The Trump Organization and the founder of Trump Entertainment Resorts. Trump's extravagant lifestyle, outspoken manne... r, and role on the NBC reality show The Apprentice have made him a well-known celebrity who was No. 17 on the 2011 Forbes Celebrity 100 list.Considered one of the best known real estate entrepreneurs in the United States, Trump is the son of Fred Trump, a wealthy New York City real-estate developer. He worked for his father's firm, Elizabeth Trump & Son, while attending the Wharton School of the University of Pennsylvania, and in 1968 officially joined the company. He was given control of the company in 1971 and renamed it The Trump Organization. After his third bankruptcy in 2009, the property of Trump Entertainment Resorts was sold to various buyers.In 2010, Trump expressed an interest in becoming a candidate for President of the United States in the 2012 election, though in May 2011, he announced he would not be a candidate. Trump was a featured speaker at the 2013 Conservative Political Action Conference   more
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NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T16:07:49.5993266Z
If Donald Trump wins the Republican nomination, then we should expect our next president to be a socialist.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T17:46:28.6516690Z
Bernie Sanders is WAAAY too socialist. Donald Trump on the other hand is just out of his mind.
Vox_Veritas says2015-08-12T17:48:58.1240924Z
Trump has the advantage of being able to cause a large Conservative turnout, especially among less moderate Republicans. The man actually has charisma. Can the same be said about Bernie Sanders and his party? An absent majority could cede power to the minority voting powerhouse.
imabench says2015-08-12T17:52:15.1221552Z
Bernie has been setting turnout records all over the place, indicating that he does indeed have Charisma. Anyone who can give Hillary a run for all of her money surely has to have charisma, and Trump is actually disapproved by republicans more than he is approved of. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/06/16/trump-most-disliked_n_7597722.html
Vox_Veritas says2015-08-12T18:01:11.8591958Z
You might be right, but please use a source other than HuffPo.
Vox_Veritas says2015-08-12T18:03:07.0503342Z
I just listened to Bernie Sanders for several minutes. He's basically a really slow speaker who thinks that the rich are ruining America and that Americans (the Democrats, that is) need to start a grassroots movement to demand change.
imabench says2015-08-12T18:05:36.4992922Z
imabench says2015-08-12T18:06:40.0540996Z
Oh shit wait did I say disapproved by republicans? I meant disapproved by the voting population as a whole. My bad
Vox_Veritas says2015-08-12T18:08:31.2905474Z
Ah. Okay. Really, though, if Bernie Sanders gets elected economic growth will slow, much less will be spent on military, there will be very little military involvement in foreign affairs, and China will surpass us after just a little while.
imabench says2015-08-12T18:10:12.2934601Z
I consider myself a filthy hippie liberal but even I find Bernie too far to the left for me in terms of policies. His $15 an hour minimum wage proposal is stupidly high which is what I have the biggest problem with. Lower it to $10 and see if that just does the trick
Vox_Veritas says2015-08-12T18:10:18.7207013Z
Donald Trump isn't that intelligent, but at least he won't make those certain decisions that will obviously screw us and the whole world.
tajshar2k says2015-08-12T18:13:56.9036999Z
You do realize that most the things Bernie says he will do isn't going to happen right? I highly doubt a $15 minimum wage will occur soon. People like him, because he is honest and will make smart decisions in the future. One of them is getting the hell out of the middl-east, and focusing more on national security.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T18:21:31.8962165Z
@Vox_Veritas China is bound to surpass us at some point. Look how much their economy is booming.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T18:22:29.4683203Z
We seriously need Conservative moderators on Debate.Org.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T18:22:29.8739229Z
@tajshar2k My main problem with Sanders though is that he supports too much socialism, even more than the nordic countries like Sweden and Norway. Yet he tries to use them as an example, despite the fact that there are other things that contribute to the wealth of those countries.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T18:22:42.5100039Z
We seriously need Conservative moderators on Debate.Org.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T18:22:56.7840954Z
@NewLifeChristian Why does it matter?
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T18:23:35.2851422Z
@triangle.128k I usually don't do this, but are you serious?
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T18:24:59.6504830Z
I'm serious, why should we need conservative moderators? Does it really matter on their political views?
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T18:25:29.9302771Z
If we had more Conservative moderators, then there would be much more balance. I constantly see Conservatives attacked by liberals, yet the moderators do nothing. Why? Because they're all liberals!
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T18:27:10.0829191Z
@NewLifeChristian I have no clue what you're talking about... You need to deal with the fact that there's going to be some occasional fighting, due to the nature of this site.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T18:27:59.6367020Z
I've seen conservatives attack liberals plenty of times.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T18:32:23.0755907Z
This site is meant for discussing many controversial topics, there are people who disagree with each other on many things, that's just how the site is. Because of that, there's going to be some flame wars and arguing here and there.
tajshar2k says2015-08-12T18:32:35.8598074Z
@triangle.128k How is he too socialist?
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T18:32:42.8954525Z
@triangle.128k Theoretically, since virtually all of the moderators on Debate.Org are liberals, we could have a case where a liberal is attacking a Conservative yet the liberal moderators won't do anything about it. It's a liberal attacking a Conservative. What do you think the liberal moderators are going to do? If anything they'll probably attack the Conservative alongside the liberal who originally started attacking the Conservative.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T18:33:50.8182879Z
@tajshar2k He complains about rich people and the circulation of wealth for one. Also, look how much he wants to tax people and his strong support of redistribution. He also supports a $15 minimum wage as imabench pointed out.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T18:34:57.5165807Z
@NewLifeChristian -facepalm- The moderators are unbiased, people are going to argue with each other due to the nature of this site. The moderators almost never take sides if you haven't noticed. If a liberal constantly flames of a conservative, they would be warned.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T18:37:13.6819883Z
@triangle.128k This is why we need more Conservative moderators. This and the fact that liberals, like 'imabench', get away with swearing and other forms of rule-breaking that do not directly involve another user because the liberal moderators won't discipline them because they are liberal.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T18:39:56.6250328Z
-facepalm- The moderators wouldn't care about imabench even if he was conservative. You're too oversensitive regarding the aggressiveness of people on here. This is a DEBATE site, the nature of this site is to discuss and argue certain views on topics. Due to the NATURE of this SITE, there's going to be slight aggressiveness. And cussing is now allowed on the polls.
tajshar2k says2015-08-12T18:40:02.7870723Z
You are actually allowed to swear.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T18:41:04.3138667Z
NewLifeChristian, you can swear and attack other people. Nobody's going to say anything unless you go overboard.
tajshar2k says2015-08-12T18:41:13.4555253Z
Mirza called me and Varrack retarded, yet the mod does not care.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T18:41:42.2377098Z
@tajshar2k You are allowed to swear? I have always thought profanity was prohibited on Debate.Org.
tajshar2k says2015-08-12T18:42:40.8004852Z
It was, but they removed the restrictions.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T18:43:40.3304668Z
@tajshar2k Why did they remove the restrictions?
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T18:44:04.9552899Z
@tajshar2k Mirza calls nearly everybody on this site born in the country between Canada and Mexico retarded.
tajshar2k says2015-08-12T18:44:37.3956326Z
1st Ammendment.
tajshar2k says2015-08-12T18:45:30.4671728Z
@triangle.128k Exactly, usually that would result in a ban, but not in this case. Mirza is continuing to spew his European bullshit
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T18:46:11.3238347Z
Why does Mirza hate Americans? Just asking...
tajshar2k says2015-08-12T18:46:48.3896723Z
@NewLifeChristian Also, it somethings banned words that weren't even swear words. Which is kinda annoying. If you were typing paragraphs, and there was some bad word, you would lose everything.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T18:48:04.0501573Z
He hates the USA for pretty stupid reasons.
tajshar2k says2015-08-12T18:48:08.1217834Z
@NewLifeChristian He's just an anti-American who holds all Americans responsible for the crimes committed by the Bush administration. Also, he forgets the fact that it was America who helped Bosnia from the Serbs.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T18:48:48.8536445Z
At least he has better reasons for hating the USA than shalal12.
tajshar2k says2015-08-12T18:49:27.4950922Z
The funny thing is, http://www.debate.org/united-states/ Look who is 2nd on the list?
tajshar2k says2015-08-12T18:50:05.7465374Z
tajshar2k says2015-08-12T18:50:30.4102955Z
Every single time I ask him to give me a source, he simply doesn't go gives me a broken link.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T18:51:12.4369649Z
He even denies that Iran is #1 in stonings.
tajshar2k says2015-08-12T18:51:56.1484451Z
He's just a waste of my time. I don't bother talking to him anymore. He can't back up a single thing he says.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T18:52:29.4234584Z
@tajshar2k @triangle.128k Just out of curiousity, which user on Debate.Org do you dislike the most? (Don't say me :D)
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T18:53:32.7130641Z
For me, it's heil. I cannot believe that there are actually neo-nazis on Debate.Org. I honestly hope he is just a troll and not sincere about his horrible beliefs.
tajshar2k says2015-08-12T18:53:33.4150686Z
@NewLifeChristian LOL, its definitely not you. Your Pro-envirionment, which is rare for conservatives. I have to say Shalal12 or RXR.
tajshar2k says2015-08-12T18:53:49.9823748Z
I think RXR got banned already.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T18:54:13.8349277Z
@NewLifeChristian Probably Pro-LifeConservative. He's a complete theocrat.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T18:55:37.9974672Z
Heil isn't being serious either. He used to have an anti-black persona, now he's just a neo-Nazi. Heil is simply just a troll.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T18:55:54.6583740Z
@triangle.128k LOL You dislike Pro-LifeConservative over some of the others like the heil and RXR?
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T18:57:12.9396758Z
I'm not sure about RXR but heil is just a troll. Pro-LifeConservative has extremely theocratic views and used the Bible as a reason for a lot of his political views. Heil actually is funny, so he's definitely not the worst person on here.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T18:59:12.2492406Z
@triangle.128k Heil is a neo-nazi. How can that be funny? Even in trolling, pretending to be a neo-nazi is not cool.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T18:59:59.1431412Z
Honestly, I would rather live in a modern-day Nazi Germany over a Christian theocracy.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T19:02:00.2467175Z
@triangle.128k If it were not for the constitution. I would be a theocrat.
tajshar2k says2015-08-12T19:02:46.8910165Z
Apparently Hitler liked Hindu's. India would be safe from Nazi genocide if Germany won. Hitler actually took the Nazi symbol from Hinduism.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T19:03:09.7451630Z
@triangle.128k In Nazi Germany, people would be exterminated. In a Christian Theocracy, everyone would be loved.
tajshar2k says2015-08-12T19:03:48.9950146Z
@NewLifeChristian As long as you are Christian.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:04:12.4966305Z
Sure, look at Islam theocracies. How would a Christian one be any different? I would probably be killed for speaking out against Christianity. I would be fine under Nazi Germany because i'm not Jewish and the Nazis had more respect for other religions.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T19:05:24.4052262Z
@triangle.128k So you would not care for my Jewish friends being killed and tortured under Hitler? That is very selfish of you to say that you would be okay in Nazi Germany because you are not Jewish.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-08-12T19:06:30.9864530Z
Except for those damn arabs ... Am i right?
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:06:31.1268539Z
People are exterminated in theocracies all the time. Look how countries like Saudi Arabia stone people. A guy named Raif Badawai was sentenced to 10 years in jail and 1000 lashes for saying he disagrees with the theocracy in Saudi Arabia.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T19:06:32.2032608Z
Thou shall not kill. You will not be killed in a Christian Theocracy, we probably will laugh at your beliefs though. :D
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:07:43.9091857Z
I mean that I myself would be fine in Nazi Germany as I could probably pass as an "honorary Aryan." It's just the fact that there are Jews being killed that would bother me.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T19:07:50.3441617Z
Yes, triangle Atheism is a religion! It's not science.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:08:19.9454167Z
It would personally disturb me is what I mean to say, but I wouldn't directly be exterminated like I would in a theocracy.
TBR says2015-08-12T19:08:27.2539983Z
Does your Christian Theocracy include the death penalty ?
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:08:43.4859676Z
I don't identify as an atheist, and atheism isn't a religion the same way theism isn't a religion.
tajshar2k says2015-08-12T19:08:50.4124120Z
@FreedomBeforeEquality Are you hoping he would say yes?
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T19:09:04.8814395Z
The Bible authorizes the death penalty for extreme cases, such as murder.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T19:10:39.2464444Z
" As long as you are Christian." Ummm. I don't know how to respond to this. LOL
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T19:11:01.4609868Z
It says Christian in my name, yes I am a Christian.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:11:35.6018709Z
Christian theocracies in the past were brutal. The goal might be to achieve peace by turning to god, but it's going to backfire. It's comparable to communism, the goal is to achieve a free society of everybody working together. It however turns out to be a complete totalitarian realm.
tajshar2k says2015-08-12T19:11:58.3389514Z
No, I mean as long as you are christian you would be loved in a christian theocracy. If you were hindu or something, you would be shunned upon.
TBR says2015-08-12T19:12:31.4579637Z
@NewLifeChristian - So would those extreme cases include any crimes described in the bible?
MrFreeThinker says2015-08-12T19:13:31.5027486Z
Socialism never works
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T19:13:32.9223577Z
@tajshar2k Love the followers, hate the false religion. That is where us Christians stand. And no, we would try our best to show the Hindus the love of Christ.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:14:42.8186710Z
Would people like Hindus, Jews, irreligious or whatever really appreciate you forcing your religion?
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-08-12T19:15:15.9610182Z
"In a Christian Theocracy, everyone would be loved." No my question was rhetorical, tajshar2k. We know christian theocracies raise armies against arabs. They always have.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:15:38.5031627Z
It also resorts to violence most of the time. A theocracy sounds good on paper to some really religious people, but it doesn't work out well as I mentioned.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T19:16:44.0079826Z
@triangle.128k Ultimately, it is their decision. In a Christian Theocracy, the Bible would be taught in school, we would share the Gospel through every way possible. If none of those works, we will pray to God that He shows the lost the path to Heaven.
TBR says2015-08-12T19:17:18.9054063Z
I have a hard time understanding why it sounds good to a Christian.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:17:22.3296935Z
Why do you think many Asian countries during the middle ages were some of the most advanced places? But the theocraticish medieval Europe had horrible living conditions. India and China surely weren't as inclined to spread religion or exterminate people that don't follow the main religions there. And look how they were far more advanced and clean than places like France or Great Britain.
tajshar2k says2015-08-12T19:17:48.3115948Z
@FreedomBeforeEquality Would you personally support it?
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:18:58.2235082Z
@NewLifeChristian Essentially, that's religious discrimination.
TBR says2015-08-12T19:19:20.9293885Z
As much as I would like more atheists in government, I would never say I want a government made completely of atheists - not as long as there are a substantial population of religious people.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T19:19:40.5543143Z
@TBR http://www.gotquestions.org/pro-life-war-death.html
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:21:36.3694567Z
@TBR Lol, that's literally the case with China. Nearly all of the CCP is agnostic or an atheist.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-08-12T19:21:50.1287449Z
Oh the Asian vs European living conditions is not a valid argument. They were practicing the same types of feudal systems over there also.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:22:30.5798042Z
But the Europeans were a lot more of religious zealots compared to the Asians at that time.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T19:23:36.3810260Z
@triangle.128k Religious discrimination? I don't believe showing people the path to God and informing them about the love of Christ is religious discrimination.
TBR says2015-08-12T19:23:54.1963402Z
@NewLifeChristian - That is fine. Now, would the cases where the death penitently applies include sentences from the bible? That is the question.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-08-12T19:24:01.8715894Z
Would I support what? A theocracy? Im wherever I decide to lay my head. Id support them until they came at me with something messed up ... Then they'd get taken down a peg.
SnaxAttack says2015-08-12T19:24:36.5740771Z
I think it would be an interesting election between: Donald Trump and Bernie Sanders. The most Conservative individual vs the Socialist!
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:25:33.9512449Z
-facepalm- You're sugar coating religious discrimination. Jews, Hindus, Jainists or whatever don't want you to preach your beliefs. They want you to keep your beliefs to yourself, non-Christians wouldn't be happy in a society completely influenced by something they don't believe in. And if they're outspoken about their beliefs, they're going to have a bunch of people annoying them with their beliefs.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:25:54.9177793Z
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-08-12T19:27:53.5018742Z
So whats the difference really ... Asian leaders claimed their power came from their bloodline. Europeans claim theirs came from their royal bloodlines ... But those were annointed by gods. So what? Its literally the same thing. They were constantly warring over there amongst themselves also. If anything Asia and Europe were two worlds mirroring one another, despite their cultural separation.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T19:28:05.6699522Z
@triangle.128k What you're saying is religious discrimination! I have the right to preach the Gospel to others. Your statement is a blatant violation of Freedom of Religion.
SnaxAttack says2015-08-12T19:28:25.8019465Z
@TBR Exodus 21:12-14 "Anyone who strikes a person with a fatal blow is to be put to death. 13 However, if it is not done intentionally, but God lets it happen, they are to flee to a place I will designate. 14 But if anyone schemes and kills someone deliberately, that person is to be taken from my altar and put to death. Here is the link: http://www.christianbiblereference.org/faq_CapitalPunishment.htm
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T19:29:28.7716849Z
LOL I'm sorry, I thought you said "you need to keep your beliefs to yourself". XD
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:30:46.7409847Z
@NewLifeChristian I never said you don't have the right to do it. What I'm saying is that you shouldn't do it and it's annoying. Jews don't want you preaching Christianity to them. I bet you don't want Jews preaching Judaism to you either.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-08-12T19:31:43.1353462Z
@SnaxAttack That sounds surprisingly like the way the law is now does it not? We dont want to credit the christian influence for that one though ... Oh no.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T19:32:01.4030633Z
@triangle.128k Yeah, well I don't want to be preached secularism in school. Technically, we do live in a theocracy now. Where the religion of secularism is taught in public schools.
SnaxAttack says2015-08-12T19:34:40.2979471Z
@FreedombeforeEquality So what if we do or don't credit the Christian influence? A religion is a belief, and no one can deny a belief. If you don't believe it, that is fine; but no one should be denied to have their own beliefs about things. I believe in the Death Penalty for certain crimes, like Murder, Rape, etc.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:36:01.4964676Z
@triangle.128k Public schools teach without regard of religion, so that means they are secular. They're not forcing irreligion down you're throat. Public schools teach without regard of religion because that keeps religion more as a personal thing. People can be free to practice and accept others of their religion, or irreligion.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:36:54.6537431Z
Why do you insist secularism is a religion? Secular means without religion.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T19:37:45.6036697Z
Public schools teach evolutionism. Evolutionism is both anti-Christian and part of a religion itself. Schools teach the religion of atheism/secularism.
TBR says2015-08-12T19:38:11.0318327Z
@SnaxAttack - Again, I ask. All biblical death sentences?
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T19:38:11.7338372Z
@triangle.128k Is atheism a religion?
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:39:04.7976426Z
@NewLifeChristian Then why are there so many theistic evolutionists?
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:39:44.5310973Z
And atheism ISN'T a religion.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T19:40:03.1965517Z
@triangle.128k The basis of Christianity is the Bible. Evolutionism, if you read the Bible, does not agree with what the Bible says.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-08-12T19:40:38.5619784Z
@SnaxAttack I do agree with a death penalty ... Though I dont agree with your logic supporting it. You could be free to believe as you wish ... Though if your belief begins to result in the deaths of others ... Well that is a belief that we can deny you. I mean you can believe it all you want ... You wont be getting it though. I dont want you to go about thinking we are discriminating on you because you cant kill how youre religion may dictate. You are living amongst non believers as well ... And as such they are not subject to your rules.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:41:29.0517673Z
There are Christians that have a less literal interpretation of the Bible, and they believe in Evolution. Look at Pope Francis, he believes in Evolution and sees Genesis more as a metaphor.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-08-12T19:42:36.5299346Z
You need to back a religion that everyone can get under ... Figuratively, the constitution. It is even more inclusive and loving than even Christianity ... If you can believe that.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:42:51.6152313Z
There are many religious people in the US, the amount of irreligious people is a lot less. So I don't see how schools force irreligion down people's throats.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:44:30.9566681Z
NewLifeChristian, what would make Saudi Arabia or Iran any different from a Christian theocracy?
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T19:47:36.5198576Z
@triangle.128k You are incorrect. Atheism is a religion. It certainly isn't based off of science! http://creation.com/atheism-a-religion
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T19:48:59.1223871Z
@triangle.128k What would make Saudi Arabia and Iran different from a Christian theocracy? The religion.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:49:13.7240807Z
Do you even know what a religion is?
SnaxAttack says2015-08-12T19:49:27.3196331Z
@TBR Rephrase the question please. @FreedombeforeLiberty My logic does make sense. Believe what you want, and thats it. I'm not saying you should follow a religion for your belief, but believe whatever you desire. Many may disagree, but that is your idea; and it can't be changed.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:50:21.7795822Z
The belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods. "ideas about the relationship between science and religion" synonyms: faith, belief, worship, creed; More a particular system of faith and worship. Plural noun: religions "the world's great religions"
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T19:50:31.8649816Z
@triangle.128k Yes, religion is an organized set of beliefs.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:51:23.9771809Z
: the belief in a god or in a group of gods : an organized system of beliefs, ceremonies, and rules used to worship a god or a group of gods : an interest, a belief, or an activity that is very important to a person or group
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:52:37.2820508Z
Atheism isn't even a set of beliefs. Religion incorporates belief and worship of a certain deity/god. Atheism means disbelief in god, that's all.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T19:52:39.7078011Z
@triangle.128k I will continue arguing whether or not atheism is a religion, but can you answer this question for me? Do you believe atheism is based off of science?
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:53:26.5627667Z
No, I believe atheism isn't based on science.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-08-12T19:54:05.0871484Z
@NewLifeChristian It's sad to say ... But it looks like any theocracy you use that has too much of a past, people arent going to get over it. Maybe instead of 'Christian' you need to make note of a specific denomination that is not known for those negative things in particular. Like say, Mormans, for example. They might have a looney-ness about them, but arent remembered for the crusades. Most religions have stigmas, look at Scientology, but under the right one you might could have something. Christianity is such a large umbrella ... So large in fact that it seems to be suffocating itself in the amount of negatives that happen all over in its denominations.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T19:54:10.7031844Z
@triangle.128k Good, at least you recognize that.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:54:47.3556846Z
Atheism isn't a religion if it doesn't incorporate a set of beliefs and worship of a deity.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T19:55:02.2459148Z
How many people am I currently debating with? :/
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:55:51.1912938Z
I don't belief theism or any religion is based off of science either.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-08-12T19:56:22.0560264Z
Im not saying you should change your beliefs per se ... But you could canonize a bible in the same fashion the nicean council did and take out the bad stuff. Maybe what you come up with would better reflect your christian attitude without having ties to all that filler and fodder that atheists and secularists attack you with.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:56:36.7903861Z
Now back to theocracy, what would make a Christian theocracy any different from Saudi Arabia?
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T19:56:50.5262089Z
@triangle.128k Atheism does incorporate a set of beliefs, e.g. evolutionism, big bang theory (I realize there are other theories, all of them exclude a deity however), and that morality does not come from a supreme being, rather it comes from man.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:58:04.9465512Z
An atheist could believe we all were an experiment by super advanced aliens, and that the big bang or evolution isn't real, just so as long as if they don't believe in god.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:58:36.1311511Z
A theist could easily accept the big bang and evolution.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T19:59:02.7526565Z
Now do you care to answer my original question?
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T19:59:10.2095043Z
@triangle.128k You completely ignored one of my earlier comments. I already answered your question. The religion is the difference between Saudi Arabia and a Christian theocracy.
TBR says2015-08-12T19:59:24.6630622Z
The question is as simple as it gets SnaxAttack. Would the laws regarding what infractions require death be bases on the same laws from the bible?
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T20:00:32.0320288Z
"just so as long as if they don't believe in god." That is a belief that is held by all atheists, or they wouldn't be atheists. It is an organized set of beliefs.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T20:01:16.2973778Z
@NewLifeChristian So is god going to shun people starting another theocracy, but bless people starting a Christian theocracy?
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-08-12T20:01:17.1631181Z
"Many may disagree, but that is your idea; and it can't be changed." Thats a foolhardy position to take if you know that any attempt at realizing that belief is going to get you punished or killed. If you cant change, you die, in this scenario. Non believers aren't going to allow you to go on killing them over your personal beliefs without a fight.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T20:02:27.4259685Z
@triangle.128k God loves everyone. He loves all sinners.
SnaxAttack says2015-08-12T20:03:22.0497839Z
@FreedombeforeEquality I thank you for having a peaceful discussion about this, i really do; but I think we should not canonize the Bible. The reasoning why is because why change beliefs in history? We look back at the past and see the gruesome things that many believed. Examples being discrimination, fear of witches, etc. But, we keep them in to show the future generation of how the past was. There will be bad stuff in the Bible, but why get rid of the bad stuff when we learn about what not to do?
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T20:04:41.7272294Z
@triangle.128k Did you read the article by Creation Ministries International?
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T20:04:54.0357083Z
@NewLifeChristian Okay, then does sin somehow make Islamic theocracies worse than Christian theocracies because of less "sin?"
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T20:06:26.0918984Z
The Bible says that people who do not believe in Jesus, non-Christians, will not inherit the kingdom of God. Therefore, the Bible says non-Christians are sinners. God does not hate non-Christians, though. He loves all sinners and hates the sin.
SnaxAttack says2015-08-12T20:07:02.7443986Z
@FreedomBeforeEquality A belief is a belief. Just because you don't believe it, doesn't mean they should be isolated for having a different opinion on something.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T20:07:19.6081067Z
I'm not reading that article, it's a very biased website that I don't trust. Also, why do you think the Northeastern region of the US is more advanced, wealthier and developed than the southeastern region of the US? Southerners seem to be a lot more religious than northerners. People in the Southeast are more likely to want to impose the bible in US law as opposed to the northeast. The Southeast also has a lot more creationists and less evolutionists than the Northeast. Yet the Northeast states like Massachusetts, New York or Vermont seem to have a far better quality of living, they're wealthier and etc. Compare that to the states like Mississippi, Alabama or Oklahoma.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T20:07:52.7739193Z
I don't care about your preaching, what i'm asking is related to religion in politics.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T20:09:57.0832509Z
Massachusetts is the third highest in Evolution acceptance, and it's one of the most developed states in the US and its people are a lot more wealthy. Mississippi is statistically worst in many aspects compared to other states, and it is the fourth lowest in Evolution acceptance.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T20:11:05.8796919Z
@triangle.128k You won't find a Creationist democrat. You will; however, find a Creationist republican. Why do you think the GOP is called the party of the rich?
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-08-12T20:11:51.8843868Z
"An atheist could believe we all were an experiment by super advanced aliens, and that the big bang or evolution isn't real, just so as long as if they don't believe in god." Those are just forms for their god that theyve chosen. The emphasis in the definition of religion is "set of beliefs", the god portion is just the blanket justification for where those beliefs come from if not from science. You said its not from science. If its a belief, its blind, its based on whatever you want to base it on ... Aliens or the like. Anything supernatural. In the case of an atheist they are believing in the non existence of god. That takes a set of beliefs to back, a set of blind beliefs, since no atheists out there knows for sure. All they can do is believe.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T20:12:56.1879990Z
"I don't care about your preaching, what i'm asking is related to religion in politics." I honestly can't say I care about your preaching either.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T20:14:13.1276922Z
@NewLifeChristian There actually are evolutionist Republicans and creationist Democrats. And how come the southeastern states usually have poorer people than the northeast then?
SnaxAttack says2015-08-12T20:14:15.4131721Z
@FreedomBeforeEquality If thats what you believe, that is your decision. Not going to stop you from having a belief.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T20:19:38.1713758Z
@triangle.128k That's a tough question. Maybe it's because some of America's best colleges are located in the Northeast. Also why chastise the South?
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T20:20:37.2333544Z
Creationism is Conservative. The GOP (the party of the rich) is Conservative.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T20:21:27.4656764Z
The best colleges are there for a reason. The Northeast usually had less influence from religion on its culture and all.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T20:22:05.4987202Z
There are conservative evolutionists.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T20:24:40.4077132Z
My point is, by looking at the effects of religion in politics on certain US states, that's one piece of evidence on why theocracy is a bad idea. We can also look at how bad theocracies were in the past.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-08-12T20:25:33.3856528Z
@SnaxAttack Do you think they (the council) thought they were selling the religion short by cutting parts out when they first cannonized it? I wouldnt look at it like that. Look, the religion was made to be inclusive, there is power in that. There are obvious flaws in the bible that people cant get past because they are overall an uneducated lot that cant pull good lessons from fiction. The concept of using fiction to teach is lost on them. Every little thing in there they find wrong grows their ignorance to god's word. What can you expect though ... It was written by humans ... Not god ... So it cannot be perfect in its ability to convey the message. I think a re-canonization serves the religion better than letting it die to the ignorant devices of man. The relatable and more truth backed sections can be preserved in a more refined document. It has been happening already anyways. Re-canonization has been happening in largely grassroots efforts where people take specific sections and translations to make whole books and lessons from it ... Your preacher does it every day. If the guy has to jump back and forth around the bible just to construe a message in it he thinks is already apparent ... Something is wrong. People are more independent now when it comes to their beliefs. They are largely not waiting around for the religions head of the institution to translate it for them, they go out and read/interpret it themselves ... And its led to nothing short of chaos. Do you realize how many people go on thinking they are operating under your same code, same idea of religion and ethics when truthfully they are on an entirely different page. That book does not portray the same message that it used to. People have changed ... The way they learn has changed. Theyre too analytical and technical ... The text needs to be tailored to that. The message is still good. At least the message I think it stands for is still a good one.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-08-12T20:26:09.1722822Z
Sorry... I know thats long but please bear with me.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T20:26:20.7631565Z
"We can also look at how bad theocracies were in the past." You can't just assume something will be bad again because of the fact that it has been bad in the past.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T20:27:37.4844483Z
Also, the definition of religion is disputed amongst various dictionaries and definitions within dictionaries.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T20:28:39.1127086Z
Technically we can. As society, we've advanced to be more accepting of other religions and to let people practice their own religion. And even today, we can look at the effects of theocracy in the middle east. Christianity and Islam are more alike then you think, because they're both Abrahamic religions.
SnaxAttack says2015-08-12T20:29:09.7201048Z
@FreedombeforeEquality If we were to change the text of the bible, what would you change about it?
SnaxAttack says2015-08-12T20:29:21.0925777Z
@FreedombeforeEquality If we were to change the text of the bible, what would you change about it?
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T20:31:00.8785521Z
As with any debated issue, it is crucial to immediately define the key terms, so I agree that we should check the definition of religion. The following definitions are found in the eleventh edition of Merriam-Webster’s Collegiate Dictionary: 1b(1): the service and worship of God or the supernatural If this were the only definition of religion, then I would tend to agree with you on this matter. Some have argued that many atheists view themselves as gods, and that they worship their own ideas, but even this would not qualify as religion under the above definition. However, look at the final definition provided by Merriam-Webster’s: 4: a cause, principle, or system of beliefs held to with ardor and faith - http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?hl=en&biw&bih&q=cache:ehsw6o7zBOIJ:https://answersingenesis.org/world-religions/atheism/feedback-is-atheism-a-religion/%2Bis+atheism+a+religion+answers+in+genesis&gbv=1&&ct=clnk There are many definitions of religion by many dictionaries. There is no single universal definiton.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T20:33:16.7944886Z
Don't try to change the topic here. You're dodging my arguments on religion in politics.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-08-12T20:33:32.6051247Z
"A belief is a belief. Just because you don't believe it, doesn't mean they should be isolated for having a different opinion on something." Ok here, concerning this, yes in some instances they should be isolated. In the form of government we use, allowing certain types of beliefs to fester is a hazard to the rest of us. Because in a democracy they could conceivably come to power if their number of believers was high enough to win a majority in any particular issue. This government actually has provisions in it that allow for its own demise ... But people who have beliefs that stand to to nothing but infringe on natural rights ... Those beliefs need to be sequestered and never be allowed to grow or hold a majority in the decision making process.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T20:35:54.7688360Z
@triangle.128k We are currently debating two things: "Is atheism a religion?" and "Is a Christian theocracy a bad idea?".
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T20:36:50.9994617Z
Let me ask you something, do you think theism is a religion?
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T20:38:17.9309537Z
"Christianity and Islam are more alike then you think, because they're both Abrahamic religions." I do not consider Islam to be an Abrahamic religion. Secularists like to categorize religions with each other.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T20:38:23.4845893Z
Some atheists might share many beliefs, but atheism itself is disbelief in god. That's all there is to atheism.
SnaxAttack says2015-08-12T20:38:24.5532614Z
@FreedomBeforeEquality The Constitution, First Amendment. "Freedom of Speech and Religion. You can believe what you want, and that's that. If many agree with your belief, that's fine; but if they don't, that's alright to.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-08-12T20:38:35.2626648Z
"The best colleges are there for a reason." Im sure this has to do with population density, age of the states, etc. Youd try to correlate population being high there to people actually wanting and liking living in that region too im sure ... Which is not the case. Its an old place with alot of money and infrastructure. Its had time to get there. Its quickly being outpaced by everywhere else though. What do you suppose accounts for that?
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T20:39:19.8945509Z
Why hasn't the Nordic countries or East Asia collapsed with the high numbers of irreligion there? Wouldn't there be a lot of "sin" in those regions?
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T20:40:03.0600276Z
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T20:41:30.2177863Z
Judaism = the basis of Christianity, established by Abraham. Christianity = established when Jesus came. How does Islam fit into this picture?
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T20:43:20.4168927Z
Islam worships the same god and was based upon Christianity.
TBR says2015-08-12T20:46:00.4037835Z
@NewLifeChristian - What? Look up Isaac and Ishmael
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T20:46:10.2239812Z
@triangle.128k 2 Corinthians 4:4 "Satan, who is the god of this world, has blinded the minds of those who don't believe. They are unable to see the glorious light of the Good News. They don't understand this message about the glory of Christ, who is the exact likeness of God." This verse states that satan is the god of this world. If he is the god of this world, wouldn't you think he would reward the ones who are defiant of God?
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T20:50:17.1423640Z
Really? Because people that support theocracy would usually argue that theocracy would mean they would bring their nation closer to god and more "holy."
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T20:51:16.0795418Z
I agree with Islam on many things; however, the one thing that seperates Christianity from Islam is the Quran. The Bible and the Quran talk about two very different gods.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T20:52:11.0698943Z
@triangle.128k In the end, we will be rewarded. On Earth, we will suffer.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-08-12T20:52:45.2809136Z
Me personally? I don't know ... Id be a bad one to pick for that task really. I would invite people who know better some of the more morally good lessons from it to take specific sections and reinforce them better ... Such that a preacher doesn't have to make interpretations for people. That would help with the credibility of teachings a bit ... Less middle man and more straight from the horses mouth type stuff. Lineages could probably be removed. People dont take those as credible anymore. It used to be that a family's lineage had power in the fact that their ancestors could be traced directly back to an event. People know that now to be a loose correlation to whatever truth may have come about in your grandfathers grandfathers grandfathers experience. People find it better to experience things themselves. Maybe parts where it actually relates to world experiences should be leaned on more heavily for truth. You could still include everything ... It just needs restructured. Put lineages in the appendix or something and put the more credible stuff in context and maybe keep it around other supporting lessons too ... So you arent jumping around. Textbooks do this when they revise. Restructure the thing to better present the lesson to the audience. You can actually increase learning and understanding by doing this without even adding or excluding any content at all.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T20:52:55.1557769Z
Doesn't the Bible say that Satan only rules under the unbelieving world or something?
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T20:53:43.2196850Z
I love it how the comments went from Bernie Sanders to Islam! XD
TBR says2015-08-12T20:54:26.5879630Z
I so don't want to be a part of your theocracy NewLifeChristian. It sounds just awful.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T20:55:21.1727129Z
Just so everyone is aware, I would not support a theocracy because of the Constitution. If it weren't for the constitution I would.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T20:55:25.1430036Z
NewLifeChristian, you should take over a smaller country and start a Christian theocracy. Let me know how it all goes, (it will probably collapse and end up in poverty.)
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T20:55:27.9743565Z
Just so everyone is aware, I would not support a theocracy because of the Constitution. If it weren't for the constitution I would.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-08-12T20:55:46.4292748Z
But yeah ... Dont they have think tanks and focus groups for that purpose. I dont have the time to study what way is best for the bible to be conveyed to an audience ... But church establishment heads have been doing it for centuries. They need to get together on the topic instead of each teaching a different version to their denominations, even different church to church. That kind of work has only divided it. It hasnt made the message stronger.
SnaxAttack says2015-08-12T20:56:09.2288862Z
But if you don't know how to revise it, or if no one knows, then why do it?
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T20:56:21.8415018Z
@triangle.128k I agree, it probably would. All of the first world countries are secular and poisoned by the atheist propoganda.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T20:58:32.0322016Z
Then how come USA and some other first world countries still have a Christian majority?
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T20:58:53.5603396Z
If it would collapse and end up in poverty, why would you support it?
SnaxAttack says2015-08-12T20:59:07.3352279Z
@FreedomBeforeEquality It sounds more simple, than it actually is. In the Christian religion, there are many forms that interpret the Bible differently. Examples include some churches supporting Same Sex Marriage, and others not. Not all Churches are going to come together and agree on one belief or another. Different types of Christians have different beliefs, and interpret the bible differently.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T20:59:52.4351170Z
Also, why doesn't Satan help North Korea and damn Germany? Because North Korea outlaws religion, and Germany has a religious majority.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T20:59:56.1556756Z
@triangle.128k I don't support a theocracy, because of the Constitution.
NewLifeChristian says2015-08-12T21:02:00.6288735Z
I don't know why I even thought of 'if', I mean we both agree that theocracy is a bad idea, for different reasons though. But, still we both find theocracy to be a bad idea.
triangle.128k says2015-08-12T21:04:44.8823264Z
But when you said Satan helps those who disbelieve, then why doesn't Satan help North Korea and damn Germany?
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-08-12T21:07:01.3520012Z
@SnaxAttack So I guess the question becomes, is the religion stronger when its divided or stronger when they are all on the same page about what it actually is that god wants to convey to them? It sounds like all this disagreement within the religion is doing nothing but giving doubt to other would-be believers on the outside as well. How can someones absolute god back both viewpoints on a topic like that? He cant ... That means one must be wrong ... Now its sown doubt and people can't choose. It could be said that theyve actually sewn sins into the very fabric of their teachings by saying that some issues are acceptable to God. Don't you see how a divided model like that actually serves to weaken the state of Christianity? In turn weakening the teaching power they possess.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-08-12T21:16:17.1523640Z
"But when you said Satan helps those who disbelieve, then why doesn't Satan help North Korea and damn Germany?" This is what im talking about. This double standard, technicality type mentality. This comes about from that division I was telling you about SnaxAttack. People can legitimately ask a question like that and be proven both right and wrong through the bible. Mixed messages to this new age of people. You cannot teach them the same way. You have to spell it out for them or they start trying to manipulate the words in their to their liking, the same way anyone who translates the bible does.
SnaxAttack says2015-08-12T21:19:30.1022661Z
@FreedomBeforeEquality Thing is, if we talk about God, he believes in everything within the Bible. God, in what most Christians say, loves everyone and highly encourages everyone to try to accept him and Jesus. Everyone, in the Christian Community, believes about this message and try to convey the message within their own belief system. All may sound different, but in reality; are actually stating the same message in a different tone.
TBR says2015-08-12T21:37:01.7050071Z
@SnaxAttack - Still cant answer if that is everything in the bible or not
mdmark says2015-08-13T14:08:39.2845535Z
@Komododragon The point is to keep illegal immagrants out of our country. Do you understand why there are a lack of jobs in the US? Because the "cheap labor" is talking all of them.
tajshar2k says2015-08-13T14:09:33.9941042Z
@mdmark Most Americans are not willing to do those minimum wage cheap labor jobs anyways.
TBR says2015-08-13T14:11:48.5605668Z
@mdmark - How about putting all that blame on the people employing illegal aliens
tajshar2k says2015-08-13T14:13:45.5457167Z
Exactly, buisnesses are using them for profit, because they can pay them very little and get away with it. Those aliens cannot even get help, or they will be sent back over the border. Businesses should also be held responsible.
mdmark says2015-08-13T14:18:49.7632668Z
You two are both also right, but there should be multiple things that keep businesses from using illegal immigrants, including a wall on the southern border.
tajshar2k says2015-08-13T14:20:36.0779483Z
@mdmark A wall is too expensive and environmentally dangerous. I suggest having non-lethal drones scan the borders, and tag people who are crossing. This way, the people at a control center, know the exactly where they are. Its a lot cheaper, and more efficient.
TBR says2015-08-13T14:25:21.4349775Z
The wall idea is folly. I agree, better tech is a better idea than a broken wall.
TBR says2015-08-13T17:53:57.0866803Z
@FreedomBeforeEquality - Who you talking about?
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-08-13T17:54:22.7344066Z
TBR, so you support the Sunshine Kid's solution to all of this then. Internal tracking and such.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-08-13T18:04:15.8502086Z
TBR says2015-08-13T18:11:58.6583753Z
@FreedomBeforeEquality - In what way? Increasing tech at the border? There are other better candidates who propose the same. The wall is just foolishness. The men who work the border have said as much. Just a boondoggle, waste of money.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-08-14T14:51:28.9713630Z
I know. I think he advocates for more of a virtual wall that makes use of better ID'ing, better employment verification, better verification all round for people who mean to collect on social programs. I think the idea of taking away the incentive to come here illegally in the first place is key. If they think life in the US as an illegal immigrant will be 10x harder than back home ... They wont ever leave to come here in the first place. No wall needed. Currently we incentivize their coming here too much by blindly giving them all the creature comforts that American citizens benefit from. We give them these out of sympathy or in the name of human rights when we should be taking privileges away from illegals as we do with any criminal.
tajshar2k says2015-08-14T22:32:24.0706825Z
http://www.edeb8.com/profile/RXR. Looks like he found a new home...
triangle.128k says2015-08-14T22:35:22.8322284Z
You never realized he moved to edeb8? By the ways, what exactly was he banned for?
tajshar2k says2015-08-14T22:36:50.8635927Z
For being an idiot. He also pulled of one of the greatest multi-accounting scams in DDO history.
triangle.128k says2015-08-14T22:38:07.3470025Z
What multi account scam?
tajshar2k says2015-08-15T00:02:24.0219974Z
He also was on some JewishLawyer account. I can't remember the exact name, but it had Obama as his profile pic. Or Drake, I can't remember.
tajshar2k says2015-08-15T00:04:43.7129928Z
LillaVanilla says2015-08-27T13:25:03.7644791Z
People really need to learn the difference between socialism and communism. People get freaked when they hear the world "socialist", like it's something awful.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-08-27T15:26:54.8918711Z
Is it not? It still involves giving up freedom we want to the state ... Just at a slightly lesser level.
Black-Jesus says2015-08-27T20:11:19.1983947Z
Communism and socialism don't involve freedom. Communism and socialism are economic systems, it is just that they are commonly associated with totalitarian governments because of the governments that have famously implemented communism and socialism
Black-Jesus says2015-08-27T20:13:33.2682323Z
That is to say that you can still be relatively socially free but live in a Marxist economy
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-08-28T15:14:51.0226937Z
Socially free and state property are total contradictions however. Some people think that being free from having to manage those things themselves is freedom in some warped way. So handing it off to the government to manage solves the problem?
Black-Jesus says2015-08-28T20:09:38.2857366Z
Well, I'm not saying that Marxist systems don't affect freedom of property. But some could argue that the freedom of property isn't actually a freedom.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-08-31T17:57:52.9645432Z
Which is basically a slope towards removing freedoms everywhere else ... Since property or material things in general are required for life ... Having power over them held in the hands of a government or anyone else out there is restrictive to a persons freedom to life.
hidude45454 says2016-01-15T09:00:48.2409583Z
Lol. Absolutely no socialist Americans! If you never live in a socialism country you will think socialism must be very cool since everything sounds so good. That is called Utopia. Let me give an example. I lived in a socialism China before and hated it so much so I came to the US for a change. God does not help me. 30 years ago, when China was a socialism country, it was the worst and poorest country in the planet, right? And The USA was the richest and most powerful country in the world. I was looking for a change form better and I am here now. God is really joking with me. After I left, China started to adapt itself to a capitalism economy and learned a lot from the USA, but meanwhile, my loved country USA wanted to be a socialism country since socialist sounded so wonderful for too many fools. Look at what has happened now, Chinese economy has been growing like crazy and look at the USA, it likes a dumping ground and I have been feeling this by my own eyes and seeing its economy going down like a dead man walking. I am really worrying about my children's future and I may need to prepare to go back China someday if there is no hope here anymore. Wake up Americans! America is self destructive since no one can beat it but itself.
JoshM says2016-02-25T04:03:21.5763141Z
Bernie Sanders may be far left for America, but he's not crazy. He cares for the American people, and I think your average independent will see him compared to Trump's irrationality and unwillingness to compromise and choose Bernie, who despite his democratic socialist label, holds values that are equality of opportunity. His two major policy points in his campaign are universal healthcare and free/reduced college. Those are both equality of opportunity, helping people get a chance to become a CEO from nothing, get out of a culture of poverty that is seen in the inner city. They still have to do it themselves and get into college on their own merit, but they won't have to worry about not being able to pay for it. Not as socialist as people automatically think.
REDtrojan says2016-06-05T22:45:53.6817915Z
Bernie Sanders isn't a true socialist, he is a semi-socialist, but because for the sake of labeling his position they say socialist. Go and google what a true socialist is and then google Sanders position.
Debating_Horse says2018-07-11T16:15:59.8662901Z
And the winner is!!!

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