If religion answers "why?" and science answers "how?" then by deduction, they must be equal to each others conclusions?

Posted by: reece

Comments would be great.

  • No, they're not equal

  • Yes, they are equal

91% 21 votes
9% 2 votes
  • Science is always more accurate then religion.

  • 'Why' and 'how' are not equal in concept, in scope. 'Why' is much farther reaching than 'how' is. 'Why' is much more complex than 'how' is.

  • As @FreedomBeforeEquality said, "how?" and "why?" are completely different questions. Science can certainly answer "why?", but it'll be a secular answer, and the problem with that is all secular answers to "why?" go further and further down the cause-and-effect chain until they reach the end, and that is where only religion, philosophy and pure speculation can provide answers. Asking "how?" is just explaining the series of events, asking "why?" is asking what was at the beginning of that series of events, which is far more difficult and far reaching than anyone can prove without a shadow of doubt. I hate to say I agree with @FreedomBeforeEquality, but "why?" is a lot harder than "how?"

  • Religion seems to answer less than science. Philosophy probably gives a better impression of "Why" but nothing for "Why" is certain. "How" we can be pretty certain about.

  • Religion would give you "instructions" for a life on a daily basis (i.e. to be holy, just, etc..); whereas Science would explain to you why we live life on a daily basis. i.e. Biology, chemistry, physics.. etc.. Two different things. It is oft that one would contradict the other based on what religion you are in: it is not hard to understand if we would take Religion as a Pastor and Science as an Atheist. Why? Because science itself would falsify the existence of God (as it has so done with deliberately trying to prove the Big Bang theory).

  • "How" can determine the "why."

  • The question 'why' persists because we, as humans, have historically been accustomed to things happening for intelligible reasons. The question, however, does not apply to the Universe beyond intelligent effect.

    Posted by: iQ
  • Science explains how natural processes work, and religion explains what science can't, such as the origin of the universe and the creation of life. Science says that the Big Bang created the universe, and religion explains the only probable cause: a supernatural being. However, they must work together. Science without religion leads to the conclusion that everything is impossible, because it shows how nothing has an absolute origin, meaning that nothing exists, which is contradictory to the obvious fact of existence. Religion without science leads to ignorance, because people will just assume that God directly affects everything without actually investigating natural processes.

    Posted by: Bob13
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Mister_Man says2015-09-11T14:59:51.8423388Z
...Except religion doesn't answer "why." Science does. It also answers "how." And any other question you have. Blindly asserting "God did it" doesn't make that a valid answer.
TBR says2015-09-11T15:55:57.0982252Z
I know where you are going. More like the "why we are here" sort of thing. I have never been impressed with religions insistence that its an important question. "There's no scientific consensus that life is important." - Hubert J Farnsworth (Futrama)
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-11T15:58:36.0340101Z
Science answers the 'why' of it, it answers the meaning of life? Where have I been this whole time ...
TBR says2015-09-11T16:04:49.3838732Z
@FreedomBeforeEquality - I think they ARE fundamentally incompatible. Not to say religious people cant do good science, just that any attempt to mix the two is disaster. I honestly don't need a "why" we are here. Lets say I am wrong about God existing - at some point it is clear it exists, and the reason for creation was boredom. I would be fine with that, I would be fine with no god, and just random chance. Makes no real difference. Not to me anyway.
Mister_Man says2015-09-11T16:09:22.5000760Z
But if there was a God and he just chose to hide this whole f*cking time, you and me would be in Hell. Might not be that bad of a place though, we'd have something in common with Satan I guess.
TBR says2015-09-11T16:13:40.1250816Z
I was on one train of thought, and got distracted. The two don't work together in any real way - in the end because they are just different pursuits. Asking any "science" the why this experiment worked the way it did, it is looking for another naturalistic why, but never meaning. Ask "religion" it will look for meaning every time. In this context, I have no need for meaning. If you, or another religious guy needs it, then he pursues the religious explanation for that. Fine by me. Just leave the two apart.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-11T16:18:43.5597506Z
Or maybe because he is 'hiding the whole time' like mister_man stated ... A person looking for the why of it, left to their human devices' turns to science to try and figure that out? Because they have to try and figure it out somehow. Why not turn to the truths that they know to be self evident? I dont see how having a why is a bad thing. It just motivates people. I suspect you do have a why, TBR, it just differs a bit. Everyone who does anything has to have one, or they wouldnt do anything.
TBR says2015-09-11T16:23:30.4286172Z
Well... I can meet you half-way on that one. When I am saying I don't need the why, I am putting myself inside the "pursuit of science" shoes. The why is not critical. Now, why pursue the scientific answer to this or that? Well, there is a personal why to each of those, right? One might have financial gain, gain for my fellow man, personal satisfaction. All good stuff. But when I come to the answer, I don't need the bigger "why" answered.
TBR says2015-09-11T16:25:42.3768004Z
There are MORE than enough good questions that need good answers without the need for the religious ultimate why. The why of it all. 42 is more than enough for me.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-11T16:37:55.9235375Z
Oh, but every question worth answering in science contains it! Again, we wouldn't feel the need to pursue it at all if the why wast there in part. Maybe you research something because in the long run it'll benefit this, why? Because of this. Why? Because this is what our goal is. Why? Because we believe this should happen. Just ask why enough times and you'll get to a belief at some point.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-11T16:39:32.6441575Z
Theres some illogical reasoning behind you initiating your pursuit of science. No ones out there doing it just because.
TBR says2015-09-11T16:42:09.9289216Z
@FreedomBeforeEquality - "Oh, but every question worth answering in science contains it!" - No. No it doesn't. I don't need the why we exist to care about how light works? Some people do, religion is there to plug that hole with speculation. OK by them, not needed for me. The endless regression does nothing for me.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-11T16:44:36.0661025Z
You dont have to regress endlessly for every decision. Its all happening subliminally for the most part. Sometimes people stop to think about it. Some people dont. Doesnt mean it isnt there.
TBR says2015-09-11T16:44:37.9923180Z
I say many times "I not doing anything else" or "I got to do something with my time". That is all very true. Curiosity, boredom. They are motivators that have no need for the God component.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-11T16:46:01.2270484Z
I mean at some point you get bored of trying to figure it out and probably hard wire an answer into your head so that next time you wont have to go back so far thinking about why something is the way it is. Thats what people do.
TBR says2015-09-11T16:46:51.7089720Z
@FreedomBeforeEquality - I am asking you to take a leap of faith here. Some people don't care one bit, and are just fine with the answer "there is no reason". Either "God" or "No reason" could be true. The one answer does fine by me, for others they need God.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-11T16:50:40.5312388Z
Its there though. You just skip over it every time, is all. I think thats comparable to what religious types say when they say "You don't know god". Or "you cant know god" (because its an endless chain of regressions O.O) or that knowing him is a pursuit one has to undertake. I dont think people naturally want to go through the work of thinking that out all the time, though. But a couple times in life ... You could stop and see how those times you stopped are all linked somehow. That makes people feel there is some kind of unity there, something higher at work.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-11T16:52:14.1630390Z
Im not saying you need it, you can get by. Im not on a mission here or anything.
TBR says2015-09-11T16:57:05.0954740Z
Well, I call that wishful thinking. Here again, we are talking about science and religion. Two things that just don't work and play well. To be fair, science is so indifferent to the questions religion has that I think it pisses off the religious. "Higher power" anything supernatural just is not in the science domain. Unnecessary.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-11T18:41:18.2645881Z
Idk ... I think it is there ... Its just a matter of how you approach it. I think youre viewing science as a belief system instead of a tool, if im right, and that belief system just starts at us and works its way outward towards that answer. Religion on the other hand takes for granted that that thing is out there and works towards it. Maybe science as a belief system is just a little more indiscriminate in its aim? More self centered? It seems like a perspective thing to me though. Because you could essentially be under either belief system and discover the exact same things ... We do live in the same universe after all. How you get there ... Or how deep you look into everything is of little consequence.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-11T18:43:18.3541579Z
Or maybe really its the only thing of consequence ... Because either way youre never going to live long enough to get to the answer. So whats it matter whether you do it believing something is at the end of the tunnel or not? Youre never going to get there either method to find out.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-11T18:43:55.9347988Z
With either method*
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-11T18:47:41.9022473Z
It doesnt matter how progressive you think we are or how much better we can make society ... 100yrs from now theyre still going to look back at us as neanderthals in comparison. What does it matter how well you set things up? You trying to cheat your way out of the period of history you exist in? Its an endless path. Where are we racing off to?
TBR says2015-09-11T19:20:27.9984504Z
No, I am saying science is only a tool. That is why the "why" question has no meaning in that context. Where are we going? Wherever we go! I hope we are looked back on like children, but there is no saying that its true. We could also just be gone. Again, you have to take it on faith when I say, its not that important to me. I have no real care if tens or thousands generations away future man is way more advanced (hope so) or dead.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-11T19:27:46.6108620Z
"I have no real care if tens or thousands generations away future man is way more advanced (hope so) or dead." Well see this feeling here is what i mean ... Being brought on by our life span. I think though that guys way way up there, big picture science guys, the Einsteins of the world, they need to care about that kind of stuff. Theyre actively making changes that will be seen ten or more generations from now. They do have that care. Some of us care about that too, out of anticipation that we will have children-children's children etc. living in those generations. I thought self preservation extended toward your future generations was a natural thing, maybe I was wrong?
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-11T19:31:28.5378846Z
I dont want you to take this as a cut or anything ... But I think that statement up there says alot about your personality and how you feel about the importance of who you are and what it is you do here.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-11T19:33:34.2746906Z
You never struck me as a man of no consequence.
TBR says2015-09-11T20:08:34.2440600Z
I have a vague interest in genealogy. My sister has done most of the real work, but it is interesting. I get to look back and see common traits with my ancestors. It is interesting, but trivia only. I expect to be a name in a book for someone in the future. Interesting, but not really anything more than that. That may be ten generations. In one hundred, nothing more than... Well, a curiosity. That does not hurt in anyway. As for the worry about the advancements of today disrupting the future, well, the case can be made that the only way to the future is through the advancements of today. Can things go horribly wrong, sure. That is true with people working at it, or ignoring it and trusting on a god that has never shown any real interest in well being.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-14T14:02:29.9659669Z
Genealogy is just an indicator of what im talking about. You don't have to be blood related. It is assumed for the most part though that with blood relation comes some higher level of concern for that persons well being. You could have the same attachment to non blood related too to some extent. Even so ... There is a care for what they next generation has going for it and wanting to set them up for success, right? I mean, whats the point of being libertarian or progressive at all if you dont care about where the next generation is going? Why set anything in stone with policy that will outlast you? Actually, maybe that is the reason they vote the way they do ... Because they literally only care about what happens today, and they arent going to see the effects of it beyond that because theyll be long gone. Idk. I don't know about that "only way to the future" bit. There are of course multiple instances that could occur where the future would still come without particular advancements we made. In fact I cant think of one yet that the future wasn't absolutely dependent upon.
chandlerrouse says2015-09-15T04:13:21.7222594Z
Religion is made up "fantasy" so uneducated fear stricken goobers of the ancient world would have something to hand on to in daily life to blame, cry to , or curse. Like your taxes.
reece says2015-09-15T12:49:53.2452496Z
I think i'm in love.
reece says2015-09-15T13:43:01.4053952Z
Oh wait, forget what i said. I'll just be on my way.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-15T13:44:52.6986488Z
Haha Reece you perv ...
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-15T13:45:14.7420140Z
Haha Reece you perv ...
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-15T13:45:53.6650120Z
Just say it was in a platonic way. We'll all believe you.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-15T13:46:15.6459756Z
Just say it was in a platonic way. We'll all believe you.
reece says2015-09-15T13:47:58.9694796Z
@FreedomBeforeEquality Well, it actually was in a platonic way.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-15T13:59:15.7127768Z
Of course <wink wink>
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-15T13:59:37.2569292Z
Of course <wink wink>
reece says2015-09-15T14:05:35.8606545Z
@FreedomBeforeEquality Why would i mean it in a sexual way if shes potentially transgender?
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-15T15:06:49.2271104Z
Oh i hadnt even considered that. I was looking at the fact that she is 15 years old. I doubt shes transgender that young. Dont think parents would pay for gender reassignment surgery before she is even old enough to know what she is or what she likes.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-15T15:07:51.1294976Z
Might not even be a she ... This is the internet afterall.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-15T15:08:13.1572624Z
Might not even be a she ... This is the internet afterall.
TBR says2015-09-15T15:10:27.1334976Z
@FreedomBeforeEquality - I notice you are having a consistent tourettes like posting syndrome.
reece says2015-09-15T15:38:33.3963340Z
@FreedomBeforeEquality I'm just f_cking with you.
reece says2015-09-15T15:45:44.5043712Z
@FreedomBeforeEquality btw just submit them once and then keep refreshing the page.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-15T17:19:13.0119849Z
I do. Actually im at the point now where i submit once and just close the tab completely, hoping that does the trick. Idk why its like that on this CPU.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-15T17:19:56.1314905Z
I do. Actually im at the point now where i submit once and just close the tab completely, hoping that does the trick. Idk why its like that on this CPU.
reece says2015-09-16T02:21:40.5287695Z
@FreedomBeforeEquality Do you double click?
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-16T15:14:49.0055761Z
No ... And its gone now.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-16T15:16:31.3110319Z
Its usually indicated by the page freezing up as soon as you hit submit. Its doing something screwy at that time. Resubmitting and refreshing the page or something.
TBR says2015-09-16T15:16:59.5004126Z
@FreedomBeforeEquality - Is there a browser difference between your computers?
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-16T15:56:43.9132972Z
Firefox here ... Vs Edge at home.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-16T15:57:37.6244415Z
This one though is the one that was having the issue ... And is not anymore. Im pretty sure it was server side. No other web browsing was having an issue like this sit had.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-09-16T15:58:16.9990939Z
Site* But then again you guys were all posting fine so idk. Maybe a regional thing?
YellowPandaBear says2015-10-23T20:43:34.7460615Z
Science is a method that attempts to answer both how and why. Religion is the result of overactive imaginations and power-mongering propagandists.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-10-26T19:13:59.9393232Z
"Religion is the result of overactive imaginations ..." So we need to restrict our imaginings eh. Be good little robots. No wonder that side feels so wrong. Its anti-human.
Black-Jesus says2015-10-26T20:07:33.1928428Z
No one is asking you to limit your imagination. His point was that theists are allowing their imaginations to spew too much into their actual beliefs. I've had detailed day dreams about how cool it would be a wizard in Harry Potter's universe, and that would be imagination. But when I start actually believing in the Harry Potter universe and I am just a muggle in it, that is when my imagination becomes overactive.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-10-26T20:18:06.7704993Z
Yeah I mean ... There was a time where people who thought outside the box like that were celebrated. Now you're telling me that you actively suppressing your imagination to fit this mold is something to be proud of. That woman who wrote harry potter, or that guy George R. R. Martin who did game of thrones, im sure everyone's happy of how much of a lunatic that guy is ... Because people like you that would have suppressed those thoughts aren't the ones writing this stuff. You aren't the ones doing anything of substance. You're a consumer of substance.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-10-26T20:20:26.2995825Z
You know what Tom Cruise and Mel Gibson both have in common? Theyre both religious lunatics that can fill a movie theater no problem.
FreedomBeforeEquality says2015-10-26T20:22:32.6615611Z
I wonder how many people would show up to see what imaginative things you've been up to over the past 6 months of your life?
Black-Jesus says2015-10-26T21:09:36.2449915Z
What is your problem? I'm not against imagination. I read fantasy books, I've drafted a couple of novels myself. I am not against imagination, I'm not against thinking outside the box. I am against actually believing in ridiculous things. Stop twisting my words.
REDtrojan says2016-02-24T08:16:19.1956721Z
Here is some truth that will really mess you up....They are both right, now sit back and think about that

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