• Pro

  • Con

20% 5 votes
80% 20 votes
  • America signed the Paris Peace Accords with North and South Vietnam and had already celebrated victory here. Then Nixon resigned, an anti-war Democratic Congress was elected, and we broke our promise of aiding them in case the North attacked the South again (which was part of the treaty) and full-out withdrew. As a result, the North went and took over the South, and a Vietnamese genocide followed.

  • Now do I think we should have gotten involved not really. But once we did I think there was no turing back. The Freanch asked us to help, so we came. The south vitnameas wanted us to help them so we did. The problem was our tactics sucked. Along with the cities in south vitname loving us, the country silde hated us and we didn't trust them. Both sildes did some bad things. But it was in the name for democracy, and to protect our nation. We pulled out due to our public hating us, our failure of forcing us always on the defense. This is one of those wars where there was no clear good or bad guys.

  • I just think we should have been more objective in the thought process as to how to go about dealing with the North Vietnamese and Vietcong.

  • As long as Americans were killed and they lost im ok with it

  • bullsh*t war just like the hawks are trying to do today

  • Tonkin incident was a false flag attack. Like what Renegade said, the war was a huge waste of precious life.

  • South Vietnam was a pathetic excuse for a nation, it initiated massive torture campaigns, was unbelievably corrupt and oppressed the Buddhists (who made up 90% of the population). Now North Vietnam was also oppressive to political and religious minorities but at least it was far more stable than the South. The US should have forced South Vietnam to abide by the Geneva Accords, have the election, and perhaps used that leverage to establish some protection for political dissidents in Vietnam.

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Renegader says2015-09-19T20:26:57.6683141Z
I can't even look at the Vietnam memorial wall of names without feeling sick and disgusted. Such a waste of precious life.
tajshar2k says2015-09-19T20:28:10.9872195Z
Just curious, why are you guys against the Vietnam war?
Renegader says2015-09-19T20:33:32.7122064Z
It was a proxy war against communism, and just as much symbolic as it was misguided and unfortunate. In hindsight, almost 60,000 U.S. casualties for nothing.
TBR says2015-09-19T20:33:51.7261683Z
@tajshar2k - What was accomplished? What was the goal?
tajshar2k says2015-09-19T20:35:44.9828943Z
Goal: TO prevent COmmunism from spreading Accomplishments: Nothing, because the U.S pulled out. Thats not what I asked though, why are you against the Vietnam War?
Renegader says2015-09-19T20:40:39.1308066Z
Even if we achieved the goal, it still would not be worth the senseless expense of lives and money. Also, we pulled out because public opinion no longer supported sending Americans to die for a questionable cause.
TBR says2015-09-19T20:40:50.8154313Z
@tajshar2k - I am a solid no for the following. 1) Internal conflict - not our business 2) Cost. Hundreds of billions wasted. 3) Near 100k US deaths. 4) Lack of accomplishment. 5) NIXON! 6) The US rallying support around killing in the name of the boogey man (at the time - communists)
tajshar2k says2015-09-19T20:44:03.2295315Z
I can agree with you on all those points. Except accomplishment. The U.S was close to winning to war, before the public demanded the U.S to back out. Unlike the middle east, Vietnam could most likely have turned alright. But we forfeited.
tajshar2k says2015-09-19T20:47:56.2512126Z
It was pretty stupid to withdraw at that point in my opinion. We were close to winning.
Renegader says2015-09-19T20:50:01.8960288Z
https://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7077/7171725458_934410dc15.jpg The war had no basis in the first place other than symbolism. There is no winning a war like that. We lost that war the second we invaded.
tajshar2k says2015-09-19T20:52:51.2684859Z
The war was about fighting communism, but the goal was a concrete one. Get the communists from power, and help establish a capitalist society in Vietnam. I disagree going in there in the first place, but we withdrew near the worst time.
chandlerrouse says2015-09-19T20:53:19.4894286Z
America lost big time
chandlerrouse says2015-09-19T20:54:30.1119867Z
Tashjar2k WRONG you were not EVEN close to winning or ending that war.
tajshar2k says2015-09-19T20:59:02.2748205Z
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paris_Peace_Accords The U.S was about to launch airstrikes on critical and strategic points in Vietnam, when the gave them a chance to stop. The North did, and the U.S said they would aid the South if the North would try something. The Anti-War people literally picked the worst time to start protesting and ended all American involvement. What did the North do? They beat the South. All efforts and all lives went to waste. I'm against the idea of going to war in Vietnam, but it was stupid to withdraw.
Varrack says2015-09-19T21:00:55.6734012Z
We'd signed the American Peace Accords with North and South Vietnam and had already celebrated victory here. Then Nixon resigned, an anti-war Democratic Congress was elected, and we broke our promise of aiding them in case the North attacked the South again and full-out withdrew. As a result, the North went and took over the South, and a Vietnamese genocide followed.
tajshar2k says2015-09-19T21:01:34.2997440Z
America didn't lose big time lol. We withdrew cause people no longer wanted the U.S to fight. Compared to the North, our casualties were far less.
Varrack says2015-09-19T21:04:38.8824936Z
Basically intervention was good and withdrawal was bad.
stargate says2015-09-19T21:05:54.4971477Z
The public hated the government and the army at the time forcing us to leave.
tajshar2k says2015-09-19T21:07:59.9494500Z
In my opinion, intervening in the first place was bad.
tajshar2k says2015-09-19T21:09:19.4631597Z
There was no point in Vietnam. Its not like Vietnamese were terrorists who could potentially attack America. Its a stupid war, which I don't think we should have send ground troops. Aiding the South would have been just fine.
stargate says2015-09-19T21:09:22.1683413Z
It was necessary
Varrack says2015-09-19T21:09:56.9658001Z
Your opinion is useless if you don't argue in favor of it. Who cares what you think. Saying "I have an opinion" does nothing at all.
stargate says2015-09-19T21:10:07.3554667Z
They would have lost even quicker if we didn't help. It was all about stoping Communism.
The_American_Sniper says2015-09-19T21:13:32.4811816Z
Stargate, are you some god who can predict whether something is righteous or something? Why do you feel we need to send troops everywhere across the globe? Its none of our damn business.
tajshar2k says2015-09-19T21:15:27.4025649Z
Ok, well to back my statement up, going to Vietnam was useless. Why should we care if Vietnam becomes communist? Its not like Vietnamese will become terrorists and try to blow up America is it? It was a stupid war. What exactly happened when Vietnam became communist in the end? Nothing.
stargate says2015-09-19T21:20:21.3598026Z
@The_American_Sniper To prove an point, basically to show that we are still strong and willing to enfore gobal peace. We are basically the only ones that at least try to do something, and I will tell you we can not allow our enemies grow in strength and numbers. We need to be willing and ready to seand our forces thoughout the world.
stargate says2015-09-19T21:21:37.9250934Z
@tajshar2k I am not saying it was an great reason, but we didn't want other enemy in the region so we attacked before the Soviet Union or China could help them. It is all strategy.
tajshar2k says2015-09-19T21:23:35.6122478Z
Why was it an enemy? Because it was communist? Thats such a stupid reasons. When Vietnam became communist did it become our enemy?
stargate says2015-09-19T21:23:54.1315095Z
Unlike you guys I am willing to fight to achieve my goals if the end justifies the means.
tajshar2k says2015-09-19T21:24:53.0355441Z
Your goal is to sacrifice American soldiers.
tajshar2k says2015-09-19T21:25:28.9625744Z
Ya, I want to acheive my goals, I'll just ignore all the people that died because of my goal, all the suffering all the terror.
stargate says2015-09-19T21:26:28.8864855Z
I am not saying it was right, but they became an threat in the region. Communism fear in the usa was running high, and we simply did not want another nation falling into enemies hands. The freanch asked for help so we came, but they left, south vitnam wanted us. They asked for us to come and we came.
The_American_Sniper says2015-09-19T21:26:48.8974868Z
@Stargate You are insane. You sound like Hitler when you say I will do anything to achieve my goal. Would you harm your loved ones if you wanted to achieve your goals.
tajshar2k says2015-09-19T21:27:46.5866566Z
First of all, they were not a threat to us. 2nd of all, Are we slaves to the french? Do we have to listen to them? We are the damn superpower.
The_American_Sniper says2015-09-19T21:28:42.7626167Z
I hate to break it to you, but alot of people hate you on this site. I don't hate you, but people are tired of your views.
stargate says2015-09-19T21:28:45.8727198Z
I am not saying it was morality right, but you forget there was no good guys in that war. We both did some bad things.
tajshar2k says2015-09-19T21:29:16.5368332Z
Ok I'm confused... Why are you Pro-Vietnam War then?
stargate says2015-09-19T21:30:52.7655600Z
I know, but I will stay no matter how many hate me, no matter how many times I lose an debate or get outvoted or when people talk about me. If they hate me let them hate me, I will not try to stop them from hating me.
stargate says2015-09-19T21:33:04.1512866Z
Because they asked for our help, on top of that I know what North Vitnam did. So I have no love for them, but I will not hide the fact that we killied a lot of people that never did abything wrong.
Pretzelz says2015-09-19T23:09:52.2155232Z
Anyway you slice it, the Vietnam war was a waste of time and effort.
stargate says2015-09-19T23:38:03.8747671Z
We failed to achieve our main goal so I will agree.
stargate says2015-09-20T00:02:31.0017717Z
http://thevietnamwar.info/what-happened-after-the-vietnam-war/ Shows what happened after we failed to stay true to our promise of staying by them and fighting off the north.
stargate says2015-09-20T00:03:57.0831235Z
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:War_crimes_in_Vietnam
stargate says2015-09-20T00:05:56.9386918Z
Remember there is never an truly good silde in an war usually. Both sildes do bad things.
TBR says2015-09-20T02:23:00.7966085Z
Then why engage in them?
stargate says2015-09-20T12:19:10.5371140Z
Because one our allies wanted us to help, two aging during that time communism fears where high, three if we won it could have been an major ally. Now I think what we should have done is one try to not kill civilians, two try to make south vietnam more stable, three attack north vietnam.
TBR says2015-09-20T21:32:55.1882287Z
@stargate - Read your previous reply, my reply, and try and answer the question again.
stargate says2015-09-20T21:55:58.4606026Z
The wars?
TBR says2015-09-20T22:33:20.8539517Z
@stargate - Forget for a moment the reasons for going into Vietnam. If you position is that there is "never an truly good silde in an war" then what is the point? It can't be a war for the "good" only for other reasons.
Haroush says2015-09-22T01:28:30.3712440Z
Liberals wouldn't fight for nothing, not even their own causes. They'd rather go hug a tree.
tajshar2k says2015-09-22T01:29:16.8283418Z
I would fight for my beliefs. Then again, I wouldn't call myself a liberal(anymore)
Haroush says2015-09-22T01:31:53.7029474Z
Lol
tajshar2k says2015-09-22T01:32:26.0887550Z
Was that a sarcastic lol?
tajshar2k says2015-09-22T01:32:56.7273514Z
Check my profile, I support the war in Afghanistan and war on terror. I'm not by any meaning a Pacifist.
TBR says2015-09-22T01:35:04.9168643Z
And conservatives seem bent on killing anyone even slightly different than themselves.
Renegader says2015-09-22T01:35:54.1472887Z
It's not about being a pacifist, it's understanding that war should be a last resort and that we do not have "infinite monies." Too much needless blood has been spilled.
Haroush says2015-09-22T01:36:07.9221770Z
I think you are more so a liberal but in all you are another hybrid Libertarian. At least that is what I get from your recent comments and stances you take.
tajshar2k says2015-09-22T01:37:14.5241567Z
I'm progressive/libertarian. I hate calling myself a liberal.
Haroush says2015-09-22T01:41:04.1836761Z
War shouldn't always be a last resort because if you wait til the last minute to do something despite enemy advances, it may be too late. If you are smart, you'd rather have a small war over a big war which is what we are setting ourselves up for now. That is a big war.
Haroush says2015-09-22T01:44:59.0386895Z
Conservatives aren't bent on killing others slightly different themselves. Though what we do value is our nationalism. American citizens should be valued before immigrants, and especially before illegal immigrants which shouldn't even be in the picture.
Haroush says2015-09-22T01:46:50.2532282Z
We value our country being protected by looking out for threats wherever they may exist and not wait for us to be attacked like that of 9/11.
tajshar2k says2015-09-22T01:47:05.5727228Z
That doesn't make any sense. All Americans are immigrants. Except the natives, whom we murdered?
Haroush says2015-09-22T01:49:00.4377317Z
We value the growth of businesses and the progress of citizens skills whether it would be education or trade skills. We value ALL people and do not put people above others because of their skin color.
tajshar2k says2015-09-22T01:50:01.5129062Z
"We value ALL people and do not put people above others because of their skin color." You know that's not 100% true...
Haroush says2015-09-22T01:56:09.4615820Z
Who cares if all Americans USED to be immigrants. The immigrants of today didn't have to go through near as much crap as we kid to become American citizens. We have laws and those who have lived here for generations should be valued more than immigrants. I guess all of us nationalist should leave the United States and go to another country? No, our ancestors created this great nation to help those native to this country to become the next pioneers of the future and help guide those who are immigrants into the way of the American Dream.
Haroush says2015-09-22T01:57:33.0011885Z
* The immigrants of today didn't have to go through near as much crap as our ancestors did to become American citizens.
tajshar2k says2015-09-22T01:58:48.5628990Z
Actually, we should be welcoming immigrants, not telling them to go away. Thats what I disagree with Conservatives.
Haroush says2015-09-22T01:59:14.8711475Z
I do know that is 100% true..
tajshar2k says2015-09-22T02:00:15.4866562Z
Thats 100% BS.
Haroush says2015-09-22T02:06:30.5286603Z
If we are already overwhelmed with ILLEGAL immigrants and immigrants causing a shortage of jobs and increasing taxes sky high because of the ACA, How are going to be able to handle anymore people coming in here? Americans need jobs. Many natives here are under skilled with hardly any education. To make matters worse they have less opportunities then immigrants because of all of the programs out there for immigrants. What are native born Americans suppose to do?
Haroush says2015-09-22T02:07:21.2133852Z
Affirmative action is nothing more than race hustling legislation.
The_American_Sniper says2015-09-22T02:07:46.5791478Z
Ya, I'm sure you want to clean sewers for a living. Immigrants work jobs, Americans like you would hate doing. Stop hating on them
tajshar2k says2015-09-22T02:08:26.4686035Z
Ok? I dont' support AA. Conservatives are generally more racist and intolerant towards minorities.
Haroush says2015-09-22T02:19:13.6387520Z
There is plenty of American citizens out there right now looking for what ever they can get. And there isn't much for them. So, you can take it as I am hating on immigrants but I am not. Most of these people we are speaking of are illegals.
Haroush says2015-09-22T02:21:20.3350367Z
No. Minorities are more so intolerant toward the conservative ideology because them being brainwashed by liberals.

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