Which is better, Satanism or Christianity?

Posted by: reece

Comments would be great.

  • Christianity.

  • Satanism.

69% 52 votes
31% 23 votes
  • Christianity encourages people to be good people that help others, while Satanism does the opposite.

    Posted by: Bob13
  • Depends on which Satanism. The one that actually worships the devil or the atheistic kind. Either way I would most likely say no.

  • God and Jesus brings peace and justice, and that's also the reason why He killed off many people, because they were controlled by Satan and sinned too much which ruined the world.

  • I've been a Christian all my life and I certainly never ever want to go hell.

  • In Christianity, God does demand obedience, but He also understands the struggle we as humans often have. God is loving, forgiving, and merciful. If we disobey God, He isn't just going to kill us and send us to hell. He gives us as many chances as we need to get it right, as long as we are sincere. In Christianity, we are free to be who we are. Following Jesus doesn't mean you can't be yourself. I don't know where people got that notion from.

  • "And the great dragon was thrown down, the serpent of old who is called the devil and Satan, who deceives the whole world; he was thrown down to the earth, and his angels were thrown down with him." -Revelation 12:9

  • Well, first off, Satan used to be an angel himself. That means that he was once on God's side and there was no reason for this argument. God has been forever, and Satan was created by God. To be honest, God is just keeping him around to help decide who on Earth is worthy of his kingdom and eternal life. So... God. :)

  • Satan is a fallen angel who was a angel but God threw him out of heaven.and will one day destroy him in the name of Jesus Christ the son of God !!!! When Jesus died he defeated sin (which =Satan)

    Posted by: Caseo7
  • the fact that someone actually asked this question is depressing!!!!!!!!!

  • Jesus commanded us to love everyone, even our enemies. It's just that some Christian terrorists don't realize this and disobey's God's most important command.

  • Lol

  • I understand why some people say that God is too controlling and that Satan gives them freedom. However, as hard as it sounds, God created us, and it is our duty to obey Him, just like how we expect the computer we make to not glitch on us. This doesn't suppress individuality, though. I'm a Christian, and I never felt restricted in any way. The life of a believer involves joy. It is impossible to explain using words, and only experience will clarify. Satan only wants to drag as many people to hell as he can, and he'll tempt people by baiting them with "freedom." They're actually not free. They're doing exactly what he wants, when it is not their duty to do so. Satan didn't create anyone.

  • I'm choosing this because I assume they're talking about the version of satanism that includes killing raping and other evil thing. If they're talking about the less known form of satanism that is they don't hate Christians, thinks that Lucifer is a symbol of freedom and that he also condemns horrible things like murder,rape etc then I would have to go with satanism.

  • Let Jesus guide you down the path to salvation.

  • Is self-understanding. Christ is our saviour, Satan our destroyer.

  • No explanation.

  • Satanism promotes individuality, free thinking and standing up for what you believe in. Satanists claim Lucifer wants to lead people away from the propaganda that christianity has created. Satanism also promotes turning bad things into good things instead of eliminating bad things altogether.

    Posted by: reece
  • Our good lord Satan only ever killed 6 people, The christian 'God' on the other hand has killed hundreds of thousands.... I think that speaks volumes about who is the true bringer of truth and righteousness to the world.....

  • I would rather honor Satan then a god who demands complete obedience.

  • Basically what everybody else has said. I would rather have my freedom of choice which part of my libertarian view. God in Christianity does not permit abortion or euthanasia because they are viewed as murder and suicide

  • Satan, if i remember correctly only killed 2-5 people whilst God killed around 2,476,633 million. And the idea that christianity itself promotes good behavior is just wrong.

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briantheliberal says2015-10-05T15:03:16.4036664Z
Bob13, "Christianity encourages people to be good people that help others, while Satanism does the opposite." - Actually that's not true, at all.
Bob13 says2015-10-05T20:30:45.2762978Z
@briantheliberal do you know anything about Christianity?
Bob13 says2015-10-05T20:34:06.9413759Z
@imabench when talking about supernatural beings, how many they killed means nothing. Satan is evil because he wants people to be evil, so that they will never make it to heaven and be happy. God brings people to heaven because he is good.
reece says2015-10-05T22:11:01.4386766Z
@Bob13 You're delusional.
reece says2015-10-05T22:19:31.6530060Z
@Bob13 By god's standards you have to worship him to be good. By satans standards you don't have to worship anybody.
briantheliberal says2015-10-06T05:09:35.1285370Z
Bob13, "do you know anything about Christianity?" - Do you? The same god you worship and claim to be the ultimate good also supposedly (according to your holy book) committed and ordered mass genocide of his own creations multiple times. Then he also sentences them to eternal damnation for a bullsh&t concept (sin) that he allows to exist in the first place. The majority of Satanists don't even actually worship Satan, they simply mock those who believe in him. And even if they did worship Satan, it would still be better because he killed what? Like less than 10 people in the entire Bible? Assuming that he even exists (which he doesn't) if he is the ultimate evil, it's your god that created him, allows him to exist, inflict whatever harm on his creations, so in the end your god is still responsible for it.
Bob13 says2015-10-06T11:32:21.9243210Z
@briantheliberal and @reece again, killing means nothing when it is done by God. Also, he doesn't say you are only good if you worship him, he makes exceptions like, "If you never heard of me you're fine" which eventually led me to the conclusion that he doesn't send anyone to hell and Satan is just a metaphor for temptation.
reece says2015-10-06T18:37:22.7168097Z
@Bob13 That's some primitive morality, 'I created you, thus i have no ethical obligation to treat you just.' It's like in the bible when a girl's rapist has to pay her father and get married to her. Do you see the backwardness? Anyway, the bible clearly states that god reveals himself within nature. Satan is real, your god is just a metaphor for the corruption of power ;)
reece says2015-10-06T18:45:36.9652416Z
"God hardened the pharaoh's heart." Just keep it real, he loves hurting people.
reece says2015-10-06T18:45:46.5747800Z
@FPSKorea1
Bob13 says2015-10-06T21:22:47.3123930Z
@reece I never said anything like, 'I created you, thus i have no ethical obligation to treat you just.' Also, you never explained why God killing people is somehow worse than Satan leading people to eternal suffering.
Crystal_aka_CJ says2015-10-07T00:12:39.8032842Z
Sorry if this sounds mean, but are you trying to start a religion war? Because I argument can go in some many different directions, sorry im also new on here
reece says2015-10-07T03:20:00.2710344Z
@Bob13 No, i was using that as a summary to how you view god. God has absolute power right? If so, then he is malevolent. Also not all (non-troll) Satanists view satan in the same light.
reece says2015-10-07T03:26:47.8424219Z
@Bob13 If you agree that he has absolute power then you should also agree that he is 100% accountable for ALL things that have/will take place. Including your version of Satan.
reece says2015-10-07T03:29:50.5806505Z
@Crystal_aka_CJ Dw, I'll make sure it's on track.
Bob13 says2015-10-07T11:24:27.9758328Z
@reece I don't believe in any version of Satan. He is just a personification of human desires. So why would Christianity not be a good religion?
reece says2015-10-07T11:59:49.3414559Z
@Bob13 My point still stands. Christianity has the same potential as every other religion.
reece says2015-10-07T12:05:29.2408773Z
@Bob13 So yes, you believe in a version of Satan. Please don't f_ck around.
Bob13 says2015-10-09T20:02:14.7219084Z
Christianity has the same potential as every other religion. What is that supposed to mean?
reece says2015-10-09T23:41:27.7833072Z
@Bob13 To come and to go, to do bad and to do good.
Bob13 says2015-10-13T00:03:53.5987153Z
Satanists can only do bad, since they worship evil itself.
reece says2015-10-13T23:16:46.6752072Z
@Bob13 That's your prospective...
reece says2015-10-13T23:18:42.3172659Z
God has done much worse things. But hey, hes the exception, right? That's sarcasm btw.
famousdebater says2015-10-15T07:54:16.6337169Z
Honestly... What a pointless discussion. If you are so confident that God does exist then why don't you debate him (or me) on the topic of gods existence. You are pro, he is con.
Wylted says2015-10-15T08:02:16.6494874Z
I'm a Satanist, and I do not worship evil. In fact, Satanists don't worship anything. Even theistic Satanists, don't worship Satan. They see him more like a friend, than a God.
BaxterDebate says2015-10-15T09:34:18.7106908Z
@Bob13: What sect of Christianity do you follow? Christianity according to Christ states that those who accept him (Christ Jesus) as lord and savior will go to heaven, everyone else will be taking an eternal bath in the lake of fire (the 2nd death), where they will be tormented alongside of Satan (who is a real angel, not a metaphor) @briantheliberal: it is not very polite to Call a concept b---s--- on the grounds of your personal failure to understand it. Also, if you are going to hold God accountable for his actions, you had best understand them. If Satan only killed "Like less than 10 people in the entire Bible?" Than I could argue that God killed less than a handful himself. The Flood waters destroyed the world, Plagues, hail, and famine killed the Egyptians, and the 12 tribes of Israel waged war across the middle east. As to why God puts up with Satan behavior, it is really simple, Your free will is not free, just as your freedoms as an American were bought and paid for by the blood of every man, woman, and child who died in your wars, Your soul, has been bought and paid for by the blood of Christ, and it is your choice to exercise your freewill to accept or reject this concept. It is therefore, not God, but you, who has the power to cast yourself into hell or heaven. (choose wisely) @Reece: By God's own admission he states that, you, as a human being were created (by him) for the purpose of giving him worship. This life that he gave to you, was for the purpose of discovering him and choosing to either show your gratitude (for creating you and giving you conscientiousness and an existence) or turn your nose up. To those who will accept, he offers paradise, and to those who reject, the alternative. It's black and white, no gray. Agree or disagree with God's motives or reasoning, it means nothing. The hubris of mankind is to think that our wisdom and understanding is greater than that of an Omnipotent being who spoke a word and created everything, and by his will alone, everything is held together in order.
reece says2015-10-15T09:49:16.8024099Z
@BaxterDebate Your response is childish... "Agree or disagree with God's motives or reasoning, it means nothing." Are you going to put you fingers in your ears now and shout out LALALALALALALA...? Because you've just shout down the conversation. Grow up and pick up your screws.
reece says2015-10-15T09:59:07.7885748Z
Shut*
BaxterDebate says2015-10-15T10:52:41.0305493Z
@Reece: "Are you going to put you fingers in your ears now and shout out LALALALALALALA...?" O-o And you believe my response to be childish? It was not my intention to shut down the conversation. The topic is "Which is better, Satanism or Christianity?" I will not speak as to the beliefs of the Satanist because I have not studied their beliefs in any great detail. What I can offer is a better insight as to the beliefs of Christianity. "@Bob13 By god's standards you have to worship him to be good. By satan standards you don't have to worship anybody." You are wrong in your interpretation of the Bible (Christian view) and I sought to correct that, lest you continue to spread false information that may taint future debates.
reece says2015-10-15T11:04:55.9130386Z
@BaxterDebate Do you know why you have potentially shut down the conversation?
BaxterDebate says2015-10-15T11:16:55.7571417Z
@Reece: because you have misinterpreted my comment and believe me to be a child? Or is it, that in using an absolute you feel that I am not receptive to your rebuttal? I apologies if I assumed that everyone else was adult enough to stand on their own convictions and state their opinions here in the Opinions section of DDO
reece says2015-10-15T11:18:00.2184112Z
@BaxterDebate Which comment?
Bob13 says2015-10-15T11:24:59.5603793Z
@reece God never did anything bad
reece says2015-10-15T11:27:46.5626532Z
@Bob13 Because god's the exception, right?
Bob13 says2015-10-15T11:29:59.3518077Z
He killed people because they were working for Satan, and Satan is evil, and didn't want evil to be spread.
BaxterDebate says2015-10-15T11:32:14.8361335Z
@Reece: You tell me, to which of my comments have you taken such offence? What have I done to shut down this conversation? Also, God is not the exception to the rules, he is the one who created them
reece says2015-10-15T11:33:44.8641564Z
@Bob13 If god has absolute power and knowledge, then he is absolutely accountable (Including the actions of Satan). I can argue with science, but this is the only way i can get it through to you.
BaxterDebate says2015-10-15T11:35:35.8065714Z
@reece: Accountable to who? Himself? Cause I am pretty sure he knows what he has done and why
reece says2015-10-15T11:36:58.8499129Z
@BaxterDebate "Agree or disagree with God's motives or reasoning, it means nothing." Please tell me where i went wrong with my interpretation? So you admit god has potential to do bad.
reece says2015-10-15T11:39:17.3614250Z
@BaxterDebate Accountable as in hes responsible.
BaxterDebate says2015-10-15T11:47:22.2707166Z
@Reece: Take a step outside of yourself, If you had infinite knowledge and created a planet full of lesser beings, and those lesser beings had a debate as to who was greater, you or the other lesser being that you created who hated you, would it impact you at all? As far as God's potential to do bad, He created the concept of Good and evil (bad) he gave this to us so that we would have something to exercise our free will on. Without the option, there would be no choice to make. He also created gravity, and yet he is not bound by its effects, but we are.
BaxterDebate says2015-10-15T11:51:58.6963457Z
@reece: Responsible to whom? Again you fail to grasp (or I have failed to see your understanding) That God is God and he does not answer to mankind for his actions because God was not created for mankind, rather, mankind was created by God and for God's purposes, regardless of if we understand them or not.
reece says2015-10-15T11:52:35.7247127Z
@BaxterDebate Take a step in, as in, in reality. Do you believe in cause and effects?
BaxterDebate says2015-10-15T11:58:15.8405281Z
@Reece: Your box is a little too full at the moment, your concepts and ideas are limited by your failure to grasp that something is bigger and smarter than you are. Reality exists because God created it, all of the laws that govern this existence have been created, this includes cause and effect. I would like to hear what you have to say tho
reece says2015-10-15T12:03:17.5210547Z
@BaxterDebate "Agree or disagree with God's motives or reasoning, it means nothing." Even though i already know you've shut down the conversation, i'll keep going. You have to answer the question though so we don't need to f_ck around. Do you believe in cause and effect?
BaxterDebate says2015-10-15T12:08:30.6979867Z
@Reece: In so far as it applies to the reality that we both live in, yes. Causality ('cause and effect) is the relation between an event (the cause) and a second event (the effect), where the first event is understood to be responsible for the second.
reece says2015-10-15T12:11:38.3530859Z
@BaxterDebate Do you believe God created causality or is it part of his entity?
BaxterDebate says2015-10-15T12:15:10.7428223Z
@Reece: God created causality, with out it, choice would not exist
reece says2015-10-15T12:19:18.6399374Z
@BaxterDebate How did he create it if there was no cause?
reece says2015-10-15T12:20:20.0583185Z
Hes the exception, right?
reece says2015-10-15T12:23:51.3019808Z
@BaxterDebate Causality still exists in a deterministic realm. Actually, that's why i believe in determinism because of Causality.
BaxterDebate says2015-10-15T12:28:34.4802707Z
@Reece: God created existence (Cause) there for existence, exists (Effect). Let me ask you this, does cause and effect still apply outside the confines of liner time?
reece says2015-10-15T12:38:46.4939957Z
@BaxterDebate But there would need to be a cause to that existence. By your logic, he could of created himself. And the short answer to your question is no. For something to exist, it needs a cause.
reece says2015-10-15T12:45:19.6044276Z
The universe has to be infinite in one way or another. I believe i, the universe complexifies upon itself for eternity. Individuality is an illusion. The universe is singular.
BaxterDebate says2015-10-15T13:03:10.8165611Z
@Reece: God calls himself "I am" ego eimi in Greek. I exist, or better translated as the self existing one. The Christian view (or at the very least, my take on it) is that God created the universe(s) (therefore it can not be infinite as it has a beginning), he created dimensions, this includes time itself. He sits outside of time, as indeed time does not exist in eternity. He spoke into being, matter and energy, light, darkness. Everything has it's being because of God, and he holds all things together according to his will. He is not an exception to the law/concept of Causality because he does not have a beginning and therefore has no end, the laws that he speaks into existence, only exist, when and where he determines them to. I know this flies in the face of science, but that is only because science has not yet grasped this concept, and can not quantify or contain it within the human understanding. We will one day.
reece says2015-10-15T13:12:07.9188839Z
Yeah, i just think it's time to let go of our imaginary friends.
reece says2015-10-15T13:15:08.8039586Z
The more we learn, the less places gods can hide.
reece says2015-10-15T13:17:02.9484269Z
God(s) = ignorance.
BaxterDebate says2015-10-15T13:25:45.0746803Z
Typical response. God is not hiding, you have just locked him out side of your little box. You are right so far as gods=ignorance. There is only one, and he created the building blocks and laws that govern your science and fuel your philosophy. As a final thought to your opinions poll; There is one God, Satan wanted to replace him but could not, so he has been creating religions left right and center to discredit God, because as you have just proven, when faced with something greater than ourselves, the ignorant begin to insult rather than step out beyond their comfort zone.
reece says2015-10-15T13:31:53.5463183Z
@BaxterDebate I said "god(s)". It pretty much means the same thing as 'god and/or gods'. Yeah, you keep repeating your fairy tale like all the others.
reece says2015-10-15T13:35:58.0279511Z
Btw, i look for the truth.
BaxterDebate says2015-10-15T13:47:53.1177672Z
And you, your "scientific" theories and philosophical circles. You have a long road ahead of you if you are looking for the truth but you discredit him as an imaginary friend and nothing more than a fairy tale. Good luck in your search, Sir. Thanks for the conversation. (turns out I did not shut it down after all huh?)
reece says2015-10-15T13:52:39.2256389Z
@BaxterDebate You did when you said - "Agree or disagree with God's motives or reasoning, it means nothing." Next time don't present yourself as arrogant.
reece says2015-10-15T13:54:45.5412680Z
Fine i'll let you in on a little secret.
reece says2015-10-15T13:55:59.2414514Z
What if i hypothetically had a dragon in my garage? Would you want proof?
reece says2015-10-15T14:00:53.9547622Z
I'm off to sleep.
Bob13 says2015-10-17T20:32:17.9062669Z
@reece "What if i hypothetically had a dragon in my garage? Would you want proof?" This is an inaccurate comparison to make. If you have a dragon in your garage, I want to look in your garage to make sure. However, I know that God exists because logic brought me to the conclusion. "Next time don't present yourself as arrogant." This is so ironic. Some examples of your arrogance are listed below: "You're delusional." "That's some primitive morality" "your god is just a metaphor for the corruption of power" "Your response is childish" "Grow up and pick up your screws." "Yeah, i just think it's time to let go of our imaginary friends." "The more we learn, the less places gods can hide." Your basically saying here that name-calling, straw men, and bare assertions prove your point.
reece says2015-10-17T22:30:37.0255858Z
@Bob13 I'm sorry, but i wasn't speaking to you.
Bob13 says2015-10-17T23:16:51.8095959Z
@reece more arrogance
Bob13 says2015-10-17T23:17:27.6581661Z
Just admit when you're wrong. Ignoring an argument does not make it false.
reece says2015-10-18T00:35:52.6729147Z
@Bob13 Look at what context i said it in...
reece says2015-10-18T00:42:21.9628009Z
Presenting your arguments with some satire is fine. But saying that it doesn't matter if you agree or disagree, it means nothing is unacceptable.
BaxterDebate says2015-10-19T09:32:13.3376870Z
@Reece: You seem to be really caught up on a comment you seem to have lost the context of yourself. So let’s play with your Dragon analogy and see if we cannot resolve this shall we? You said, "What if I hypothetically had a dragon in my garage? Would you want proof?" Logic stands to reason that I would not take you at your word, indeed I would very much like to see this dragon myself. However, should I Agree or disagree that you are in fact telling the truth means nothing to the reality of the situation. That being, do you actually have a dragon in your garage or have you told me a lie. My role in this scenario does not alter the underlining truth of the situation. Much in the same way that your choice to Agree or disagree with God's motives or reasoning (or his criteria) for why some people will go to Heaven and some to Hell, means nothing to God. If you don't believe in gods or God, why do you carry such a heavy conviction towards them? As far as Satire is concerned; ridiculing someone with the intent to shame them into believing your argument is unbecoming of a debate. Yet this is what you have tried to do. Bob was just in pointing out your "satire" as it is borderline bulling, and if I may be so bold as to say, it is unacceptable conduct for someone trying to argue facts and proofs.
reece says2015-10-19T12:27:53.0731190Z
@BaxterDebate Yes. I'm telling the truth. My dragon says he's the true god. He wants everyone to be united under his glory. I carry the conviction because religious ideology can be dangerous, especially in power. A person deserves satire if facts, evidence or "reasoning" means nothing to them.
BaxterDebate says2015-10-19T12:52:12.0114502Z
@Reece: once more you fail to address the actual content of our discussion, but I have come to expect little from you in the form of intelligent conversation. Ironically, Satan is portrayed as a dragon who seeks to unite the world under his banner. Aside: Facts, evidence, and “Reasoning” are all contingent on Perception, interpretation, and accuracy which can all be exploited and manipulated to reflect whatever opinion the presenter wants. Religious ideology is very dangerous. However, don’t be so foolish as to believe that just because science has masked its religion under the guise of being “non-faith based,” That is any less dangerous.
reece says2015-10-19T13:04:00.4851992Z
@BaxterDebate Give me a f_cking break. Dude, i don't know who's more batsh_t crazy, you or Bob13. You're expecting an intelligent conversation while you're saying science is a religion? I'm done with both of you. PM me once you guys are at the grown-ups' table.
Bob13 says2015-10-26T21:01:16.2397762Z
@reece Seriously, the dragon analogy makes no sense. If there were evidence that your dragon existed, I would believe you. Since there is evidence for God, belief in him makes sense. Also, if you want an intelligent conversation, don't be so quick to insult us.
drew15 says2015-10-29T16:14:42.1956337Z
@reece you clearly don't understand Satan created evil, so why would God be bad?
drew15 says2015-10-29T16:17:35.7807144Z
@reece Yes god did created Satan. He used to be an angel, but he thought he should be higher than god. So created Hell
DrEvel says2015-11-14T04:55:07.6047708Z
It is somewhere up there as NorwegianIntellect pointed out on the deaths attributed to god and that does not include Noah's flood and Sodom and Gomorah. Apparently is pointless to count them when Kill Them All pretty much says everything. As far as Lucifer, well he killed 1 and I think the other 9 is because he was dumb enough to make a bet with god. Unfortunately god could not bring back to life Jobs wife and kids so he conveniently rewarded him with new wife and family. These so called god believers can't even agree who god is and of course the christian god is best because... Just look at how many people he killed. Clear winner! The so called Devil, what a loser.
Bob13 says2015-11-23T00:29:26.9287539Z
@DrEvel Why does it matter if God kills someone? They go to heaven.
reece says2015-11-23T00:52:59.4528992Z
@drew15 God is all-powerful and all-knowing right? If so, then God created Satin KNOWING he would Rebel and create evil. It sounds like God needed a scapegoat.
reece says2015-11-23T00:53:53.8965502Z
Satan*
Bob13 says2015-11-23T00:58:48.3758625Z
@reece How would we have free will if our choices were limited by the nonexistence of evil? He had to either create evil or make humans under his absolute control. If I were in his position, I would have made the same decision.
reece says2015-11-23T01:01:07.7921688Z
@Bob13 I don't know, ask your all-knowing and all-powerful god.
reece says2015-11-23T01:05:27.7801022Z
By the way, i personally don't believe in freewill. I believe in deterministic chaos.
Bob13 says2015-11-23T01:07:22.8137648Z
@reece Let me clear up something for you. I am not a Christian nor do I believe in the same God. I was raised in a Christian family and I know what the religion teaches. I cannot ask God about this for 2 reasons: 1. I do not believe the things I am saying about him. I am only saying what Christianity teaches. 2. My disbelief in the abilities of prayer is one of the reasons I am no longer a Christian.
Bob13 says2015-11-23T01:10:05.6923207Z
@reece Common sense is enough to believe in free will. You chose to post that comment when not doing so was an option; therefore, you had the ability to choose, which is free will.
reece says2015-11-23T01:17:32.4110571Z
@Bob13 Freewill belongs in the same category as luck, miracles and randomness. Free Will doesn't belong in a world of causation. Choice is merely an action of a potential (the scientific use of potential.)
reece says2015-11-23T01:18:57.2589132Z
Things only look chaotic because of our ignorance.
Bob13 says2015-11-23T01:19:56.5697330Z
@reece You just admitted that choice exists, and free will is the ability to choose.
reece says2015-11-23T01:27:35.7059898Z
@Bob13 Free will is the ability to have will without cause. On the other hand choice is.
Bob13 says2015-11-23T01:30:44.4023802Z
@reece This was about how free will would be pointless without evil. Many people will want to do things that are immoral, and they would do evil things when they have the option. The nonexistence of evil would be a limitation on their ability to choose, which eliminates free will.
reece says2015-11-23T01:52:35.2463773Z
@Bob13 You're only talking about specific choices. You would still have free will.
Bob13 says2015-11-23T01:55:56.3290883Z
@reece You would not have free will because you would sometimes be forced to make a decision because the one you would normally choose is eliminated by the nonexistence of evil.
reece says2015-11-23T02:12:53.3333690Z
@Bob13 There is always two choices.
BaxterDebate says2015-11-23T13:11:42.2774861Z
@DrEvel Job’s wife did not die. With respect to Job’s reward, he was given back twice as much as what was taken from him. His Children after being killed went to paradise, God gave him another child for each one that was lost, so that, When Job died and was taken to paradise, he would have double the children, thus fulfilling the blessing for remaining faithful. @reece You are still rationalizing based on the assumption that God operates within your perceptions and concept. He exists outside of time, as such he has given us free will, yet he already knows the outcome for those choices and has made plans for us and given us choices to make. Causality only exists within time. @Bob13 Christianity is not so much a religion as it is a personal relationship with God. If you do not believe in him, than you are not drawing your answers (wisdom) from him, as such, you are missing vital information with regards to the Christian Faith, and Views. It’s not helpful to have you speaking on behalf of a Faith you do not fully comprehend.
reece says2015-11-23T13:32:40.6278197Z
@BaxterDebate So you pretty much said god works outside the realms of causation.
BaxterDebate says2015-11-23T13:37:14.0472670Z
He exists outside of our (human) concept and understanding of the restriction of causality.
reece says2015-11-23T13:38:02.6409555Z
@Bob13 Don't stoop to this guys level. Do you know what sort of people draw wisdom from god? People that have lost their mind.
reece says2015-11-23T13:40:14.6629092Z
@BaxterDebate So there's another part of causation that we're not aware of?
BaxterDebate says2015-11-23T14:27:35.0147017Z
@Reece There is a lot that we are not aware of. The first known use of the term was in 1615, since than it has evolved as human intellect has grown. Much like everything else found in our collective intelligence. You know as well as I do, that we as humans do not understand everything. Our understanding comes from our perceptions and foreknowledge, how radically that will change if one key element was to change, such as the time constant, or the nature of matter, or energy. For the record, I have my mind fully in tact thank you very much. The same can not be said of our free thinkers who came up with their great concepts whilst under the influence of psychedelic stimulants and depressants.
reece says2015-11-23T14:46:54.7892672Z
@BaxterDebate So do you agree it's comprehensible? Bad ideas get dropped by the scientific community. Great minds have been well-known to use psychedelics to be creative. But depressants, Where did you get that from? Anyway, the use of drugs occurs throughout the animal kingdom for recreational purposes.
BaxterDebate says2015-11-23T15:19:25.4666275Z
@Reece Alcohol, sedatives, tranquilizers, calmatives, soporifics, hypnotics, used to alter normal state of minds or induce a dream like state of self awareness. Can I ask why a person claiming to be in touch with a divine being (that can not be scientifically proven or Disproved) has obviously lost his mind, But Great thinkers who are blitzed out of their wits can come up with irrefutable, creative truths ? There is a difference between mankind and the animal kingdom. For one, I have never seen a stoned a Koala or a baked big horn ever sit and ponder creation or question their existence. As far as comprehension goes, yes. But there is more to existence than what can be scientifically quantified (with our current understanding)
reece says2015-11-23T15:35:19.3502481Z
@BaxterDebate 1. Dream like state of self awareness? Questionable 2. Because people who claim to have been touched by divine beings when receiving brilliant idea often contradicts their own doctrine. Also what about when multiple people claim to be touched by differing gods? It's hysteria. 3. There is no difference between mankind and the animal kingdom. We're run by the same rules. Don't appeal to extremes. 4. So we're able to understand the causation of god?
reece says2015-11-23T15:37:53.1184624Z
Sorry about the spelling, etc. I need to go to sleep.
BaxterDebate says2015-11-24T12:45:43.9273915Z
@Reece: Humor me (if you would be so kind) and suspend your own belief for a second. Follow this line of thinking; God is real, he started by creating a breathtaking creature (Lucifer) who he knew would betray him. So he used Lucifer to play the devil’s advocate to create choice (Right vs Wrong- Good vs Evil). Lucifer has always wanted to be God, and so, to piss God off because he cannot be (or beat) God, Lucifer imitates God in order to cause chaos and sway the hearts and minds of the creatures that God designed (and loves) in his image. (2) All of these people who are trying to have divine revelations are getting them. The only problem is, they are getting them from Lucifer, not God. Sure some are kind of on point but they always have some major fault in them. Much the same way that there are a million religions out there all claiming to be the one true religion. All of these things are set about to sway the minds of people to either accept a false religion, or to see the hypocrisy and hate all religion. Either way the result is the same, Lucifer has done his job. There is choice in the world. On the subject of mankind vs the animal kingdom (3), when have you ever witnessed an animal fashion for itself: tools for transportation, augmentations (Glasses, Prosthetic, or weapons), and sources of power, heat, or light? Have you ever known an animal to try and change the ecosystem they are in, to better accommodate themselves? Do animals practice selective genocide? (4) To those who understand God, his ways are not completely unknowable. It is a little like having a doctor walk into a computer programmer’s office, sit down and try to write code. Yes they are really smart in their own field, but they will bring their own ideas about how it should be done, ideas that do not work outside of their own profession. This on top of the fact that they really have no clue what is going on, because they do not understand all of the rules, tools, and jargon. If the programmer is there with them, giving a tutorial, than the doctor will be able to understand and comprehend to a point (based on the programmers level of ability). It’s the same for people who try to look into Faith and that relationship with God but kick God out of the room. Anyways, you can unsuspend your own beliefs and continue on. Thank you for your time and hopefully you understand a little more about the other side of this argument.
reece says2015-11-24T13:15:46.5035061Z
@BaxterDebate Can you please just try to actually think.
reece says2015-11-24T13:24:52.0632089Z
How do you know the difference between God's wisdom and Belphagor's?
BaxterDebate says2015-11-24T13:43:51.1523070Z
@Reece: I know you are going to hate this answer but it is really simple. The Bible is the living word of God, when one truly accepts Christ, they receive The Holy Spirit, (The three make up a Tri-une God) who acts as a mediator between God and Man, allowing us to understand the known will of God (what is written in the Bible) The reason people, who do not believe, can not understand the bible is because they lack the cipher (The Holy Spirit). You may look at this and say it is just a bunch of religious ignorance, but that's because you, yourself, are ignorant to the world that exists just beyond your own ability to understand. You keep telling me (and others) to think, but all you are really saying is "Think at a level that I can understand," Why don't you go take some LSD, and ask Belphagor to share some of his wisdom with you? I guarantee if you open yourself up to Satanism, Satan will accept you. (I would prefer you try the opposite first, cause hey, If you do not like God, Satan will always take you back.)
BaxterDebate says2015-11-24T13:45:09.4014054Z
@Reece: I know you are going to hate this answer but it is really simple. The Bible is the living word of God, when one truly accepts Christ, they receive The Holy Spirit, (The three make up a Tri-une God) who acts as a mediator between God and Man, allowing us to understand the known will of God (what is written in the Bible) The reason people, who do not believe, can not understand the bible is because they lack the cipher (The Holy Spirit). You may look at this and say it is just a bunch of religious ignorance, but that's because you, yourself, are ignorant to the world that exists just beyond your own ability to understand. You keep telling me (and others) to think, but all you are really saying is "Think at a level that I can understand," Why don't you go take some LSD, and ask Belphagor to share some of his wisdom with you? I guarantee if you open yourself up to Satanism, Satan will accept you. (I would prefer you try the opposite first, cause hey, If you do not like God, Satan will always take you back.)
reece says2015-11-24T15:02:16.7373428Z
@BaxterDebate Snap out of it. You're appealing to consequences.
BaxterDebate says2015-11-24T15:16:41.4241999Z
Pretty sure I mentioned that you would not like it. But that's the best part about opinions and beliefs. We are all entitled to our own.
reece says2015-11-24T15:26:03.3949975Z
@BaxterDebate Do some reasoning exercises. Try finding as many alternative positions as you can when someone conveys an opinion or argument.
kakos218 says2015-11-30T22:56:35.4669545Z
I don't under stand why people hate satin he is the one that punishes all the evil in the world
BaxterDebate says2015-12-01T09:24:49.8193426Z
@kakos218 - could you elaborate on that statement please
reece says2015-12-01T09:43:41.6142074Z
@BaxterDebate Do the reasoning exercises i explained with kakos218's comment.
BaxterDebate says2015-12-01T09:56:09.4734134Z
@Reece I could make a million assumptions as to what he thinks and believes. I would rather hear an explanation from him as to why he believes what he has said in his comment and how it is he has come to this conclusion. For the sake of augment, my general assumption is that he has heard that Satan is the ruler of hell and will be there tormenting those who have sinned and damned to hell for eternity. If it turns out that he is a Satanist, I would like to know more about his stance and belief so as to gain a better understanding of that religious point of view.
reece says2015-12-01T10:01:03.3131298Z
@BaxterDebate I'm not telling you to type them out. Just think of them. Asking the question is correct. I'm trying to help.
anc2006 says2019-10-05T19:48:28.6108751Z
God is better than satan, But Christianity is just a misinterpretation
anc2006 says2019-10-05T19:48:41.4806276Z
God is better than satan, But Christianity is just a misinterpretation

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